Facts Rivaldo player of the year.
Veron - the engine that runs Lazio.
Ronaldo, Batistuta, Ronaldinhio, Salas, Zamarano etc
They have the best strikers
Chiverlat ?Spelling Best keeper in the world
Walter Samuel Most expensive defender in the world
Roberto Carlos, Ze Carlos, Fellippe etc Best Left Backs
Emerson Best Defensive Midfield

With out a doubt the South Americans have the superior players at every position.

In fact England is only beginning to experiment with Brazilian style football. There is no one in all of England except maybe Juninhio who can dribble up the middle. The closest is Giggs and he doesnt even compare to a magician like Denilson or Ronaldo that have ball control skills coming out of their ears.

Wich tap water is better ???

France World Champions - Fact
France is NOT in South America - Fact

I guess this is a follow on from the last topic similar to this one, so I won't even bother no matter what I say you'll still believe that so never mind. For the record, yet again, I think that both European and S.American players are, generally, of equal skill and technical proficiency, but I concede that the South American players have more flair.

This is a facking ridiculous topic - FACT

Good players come from all corners of this wee planet.

Juninho ,are u kidding.

FACT: BRAZIL IS STILL THE NUMBER ONE TEAM IN THE WORLD.
FACT: BRAZIL HAS WON MORE TITLES and GAMES THAN ANY OTHER TEAM IN WORLD CUP HISTORY, AND IS THE ONLY TEAM TO HAVE MADE IT TO EVERY WORLD CUP.
FACT: whatever Juninhio said.

um .... you should drink tap water, get at water filter, im sure they are twenty dollars at the nearest store. OR U CAN DRINK MILK!!

Brzil sucks

No wonder Brazil lost the world cup to france, trying to dribble up the middle with Petit and (at the end) Vieira there you definitely ain't gonna get far.
Woody , I don't see your point with the number one team thing. So Brazil is numero uno, so what ? Does that make them technically superior to other teams/players just cause they're number one ?
Juninhio, did u know that football consists of more than just dribbling and controlling a ball ? There's things like goalkeeping and all the skill involved there, defenders , midfielders and attackers and all the skills involved there too. Then there's coaching, captaincy, game plans and so on and so forth. Point is that if you wanted to say that South americans in general have better dribbling and ball control skills I would probably agree, but to say that they are technically better, soooooo better, I just can't agree with that.

Edoardo,

I know that English tap water stinks. Never had S. American water.

Whoops, looks like I accidently stumbled into a page full of postings from a bunch of twelve year olds. What a stupid topic
Where's my beer?......

Let us take a look in the world rankings. In the top 20, there are 16 European teams, 3 South American teams and Mexico.

Let us take a look at the players.

GK: Schmeical, Barthez, Van Der Sar, Seaman, etc. The only good South American GK is Chilavert.

DEF: Thuram, Desailly, Maldini,Mattheaus, etc. So you have Roberto Carlos, anyone else descent?

MID: Beckham, Zidane, Hierro, Raul, etc. compared to Denilson and Rivaldo, oh wow1

FOR: Bierhoff, Vieri, Owen, Bergkamp, etc. so you have Ronaldo and Batistuta but every player mentioned above is equal to any south american striker and better than Salas, Zamorano, Bebeto, etc.

Have I proved my point?

I think that we should someone should make a south american dream team and a european dream team and simulate it. EUROPE WOULD CLEARLY WIN!!!!!!!!!

No need as this has all ready happened.it was a game before WC98 and the two forwards on one team were Ronaldo and Batistuta and they completely destroyed the other team the score was 6-2 also there was an all African stars vs Euro stars and the Africans won 2-1.but do you realy belive these games prove a point !!!

They both have 8 world cups, and matches against teams from each continet result in low socoring games. If you ask me South America and Europe are equals.

Ah... Now I understand your point Italy 82...
I know it's hard when your team lose a WC final, but You have to move on. You will not change the final saying they suck... http://www.soccergaming.com/ubb/smile.gif

ZZUB I don't drink beer but I will drink a orange juice with you.
Come on, This kind of post make my laugh very much! It's very good after the work! http://www.soccergaming.com/ubb/smile.gif))))

South Americans may be classy but overall they aren't better than Europeans.

Here's why:

France World Champions...
No decent South American leagues
No World class defenders who can defend!
Juninho, Denilson, Ronaldo (all had major problems recently)
The only strikers are Ronaldo, Batistuta and Salas, compared to Owen, Shearer, Schevchenko (However you spell it), Raul, Vieri,
Europe is the home of football
Chilavert is nothing compared to Schmeichel, Buffon, Seaman, even Schwarzer (Chilavert plays in a turd league)

Please dont tell me you mean the Emerson who played for Boro is best in the World because I watched him in every game for a year and he isn't half as good as Paul Ince

And what are you talking about England playing Brazilian football, WE PLAY ENGLISH FOOTBALL... I am a Middlesbrough fan and Juninho and Emerson are turd as they can't adapt to England... (e.g. Boro were fourth in the league, they sign Juninho... finish 14th, Boro were 2nd in the league, they sign Juninho they are now 8th)

Anyhow Giggs is a far better defender, crosser, shooter, who is stronger than Denilson and Juninho...

FACT MANCHESTER UNITED ARE WORLD CHAMPIONS

FACT THEY HAD NO BRAZILIANS IN THERE SQUAD

YLK What are you talking about Chilavert playing in a turd league...Not only is Chilavert good at blocking penaltys hes also 85% efficiant when shooting them and he has scored many goals in free kicks,and the Argentine league is one of the top leagues and their national team has done way better than England in worldcups alone it has been two times champion and two times 2nd place...and Brazil and Argentina leagues are decent unlike European leagues they dont depend on foreign talent to juice up their squads and they produce so many talented plyers that they are constantly beign exported worldwide...last name me country that exports more players than argentina or brazil you wont find one he he....

ERMMM... Cough Edoardo

Why do players from Argentina go abroad...

TO PLAY IN A DECENT LEAGUE!!!

Look if the Argentinian League is so good then the good Argentinian players would play there but the Argentinian league is not good, it's turd, thats why the Argentianians and Brazilians move abroad... So they can play in a decent league. England dont export players because English players want to play in England, because we have a good league. The same goes for Italy and Spain. Well, good Italians and Spanians stay in the top three leagues in the world (Which are all European). France export about as many players as Brazil and Argentinia because they don't have a fantastic league. Even though they are the best team in the world... (Oh and they are European)
And err... Manchester United are the best club in the World (Oh they are European and they had no South Americans when they won the World Club Championship)

OH AND WHO MADE FOOTBALL... ENGLAND (European)

Oh and for that last coment you made France and Holland both export many players.

Well YLK you already show that you don't know nothing about our league when you say the Argentinian and Brazilian leave their coutries because they want to play in better leagues, or are you too innocent or dumb to beleive that ( Oh Let's play at the Italian league! That's a better league! Oh yeah let's go! ...)

And France export as many players as Brazil and Argentina... http://www.soccergaming.com/ubb/smile.gif You guys make my laugh so much! Tks! Just Spain has 63 Argentinian players... Portugal has more then 50 Brazilians players. Last time I saw CBF numbers, more then 150 Brazilians players play in South America.

Don't know about Argentinian league, but when which league starts 14 teams could win the championship? Which league in 29 years don't have the same final, ever? Which league in 10 years have 7 champions? And which league present Ronaldo, Romario, Garrincha, Cafu, Rivaldo... to the world, because they play here before, yes! They had a life before Europe! http://www.soccergaming.com/ubb/smile.gif

But, I am not saying that is better then Italian league, but just that before you say something learn about it.

yes this is a dumb-ass topic.

But I think that China were actually the ones to invent football, I may be wrong, but I am sure I read that somewhere...kinda like the way Norway was the country who invented hockey....I think that is what I heard...I may be wrong....

to my understanding the English did write down the rules for footie and are a key factor of the game but i wouldnt go as far to say that they invented it since versions of the game were all ready beign played all over the world.also south american players go to europe because euro clubs are willing to pay big money for them and in south america their not beause they can pick any kid of the street and he will be just as good...and you still havent answered my question of why euro leagues dont try to suceed without any foreigners.

OH come on guys
the last game
BRAZIL Vs. World Selection
who won? (I Know BRazil didn't lose that game!)
why are so many latin american players at Europe?
Are Europeans Managers Crazy?If European Players are better why do they contract LA players?wow...you have the best players and the stupid managers..haha!
and...
wow....
I didn't know the europeans were the best players in the world...

Ah..blargggg...
come on ...
Latin American Players Rock's!!!
Ronaldo
Batistuta
Roberto Carlos
Rivaldo
Felipe (you don't know this guy...do you?!)
Have you all ever heard about a guy called: Edson Arantes do Nascimento - nickname: PELÉ?
Hm...let me think.
Sony Anderson - isn't this guy a good one?
Élber - isn't he playing for germany national squad??? Why is he there?cuz he know he isn't good to play for brazil!!!

About Brazil vs. France..
on that match Brazilian team was without Ronaldo (he was in the pitch..right!) and all the team was ..sad ..about the episod that happened!

In normal conditions Brazil would have never Lose!

SO....SURRENDER TO LATIN AMERICA SOCCER! http://www.soccergaming.com/ubb/smile.gif

Burner ,u r really stupid .First of all Ronaldo scores only on penalty shot and hes a faggot cause he keeps getting injured.Burner ,you named some crappy brazilian players .Here are a few europeans that can easily beat those South Americans.
Gk-Van der sar
Gk-Schmeichel
Gk-Buffon
Def-Maldini
Def-Hierro
Def-Mihailovic
Def-Thuram
Def-Stam
Def-Dessailly
Mid-Zidane
Mid-Davids
Mid-Boban
Mid-Beckham
Mid-Overmars
St-Vieri
St-Schevchenko
St-Bergkamp
St-Inzaghi
St-Suker
St-Del Piero
St-Bierhoff
and many many many more.
Burner ,you keep talking about legends like Pele,What about Cruyff,sounds familiar?Or perhaps Beckenbauer,Dino Zoff,Van Basten,Platini,Klinsmann,Puskas etc...Before you say anything ,European players are as equal or even better than South Americans.

You know .... I think ITALY82 should move on from the past, I know Brazil beat Italy in the final (and if u were watching the same game that me and everyone else in the world was watching, you know that Brazil completely outplayed Italy, and Italy was lucky to get to the penalties) ... but still, move on. Brazil is the best .. I dont see Italy tearing up Europe. Didnt they get beat by Belgium in Italy?? (nothing personal to Belgian fans, they deserved that win)

Canoe, Brazil is numero uno in the rankings because they are technically superior to all the other teams ... why else do u think they are number one?? geez ... where was your logic??

ZZUB ... beer sucks ... try Bailey's and milk. The best stuff on Earth, or maybe a screwdriver. (thats a drink .. Vodka and OJ)

Simonius_13 .. B4 WC 98, FIFA had an All-Star game ... Eurpoe vs South America (it was acutally the Rest of the World Team, but only Weah mabe the starting line-up) and the Rest of the World won .. 6-2. Ronaldo scored four, BatiGOL scored twice. So much for European defence. Oh and in mid-field you forgot Simeone, Veron, Assuncao, Leonardo, Poyet, Juninhio .... in Defence you forget Cafu, Zanetti and that defender for River Plate, I forget his name ... um .. where the Plate fans at?? At forward ... you forgot Elber, Santa Cruz and Yorke. but ... BIEFHOFF?? BETTER THAN SALAS?? WHAT YOU DRINKING?? (I will end with that)

Maybe FIFA should organize a match betewen South America and Europe.

It's called HEART, which the south american teams and players don't have, which is also very important. True Dat, dumb topic.

Ok this topic is soooo funny to read cause you all sound like idiots.........but i just had to join you guys!!!

When i read this it seems that when the South Americans write about their best players they are always from Brazil, Argentina, Chile...and a couple from other countries.

But Europe has great players from most countries...
You name the best Sth Ameriacan player from every Sth American country and im sure they wouldnt compare to the best player from every European country

maybe u should change your topic name to
"BRAZILIAN AND ARGENTIAN PLAYERS ARE SOOO MUCH BETTER TECHICALLY THAN EURO PLAYERS..."

I want to apologise to my mum, and Woody007's mum, and all the other guys's mums, sorry for not 'using my logic' when I fully knew that Fifa's ranking is based upon teams being technically better than others and not based upon actually match results.
Please note that technically inferior Norway beat technically superior brazil twice in 98.

Brasil lost that game vs Norway in WC on a bad pk call, and anyway I think they didnt want to win that game, just like they lost their last group game in 94 vs Sweden.

Also- all star matches mean absolutely nothing as it is players treat it as vacation, did you see Brasil-Barcelona? it must have been the most awful game I ever saw, the Europe vs rest of world in Marsaille 97 was another awful game.

I think the only way to make it work is to offer 10 or 20 million dollars to the winners, then maybe youd see a good game...otherwise forget it id rather watch the weather channel

European teams are far, far better than South American teams. The South Americans play a flashy game that falls apart as soon as it hits something solid ie. Brazil vs. France. And if the South Americans are so great why are Brazil and Argentina the only decsent team on the entire continent? Europe has Germany, England, France, Italy and Spain just to name a few. I'm not questioning that Brazil is a great team but when it comes to the big picture Europe is far superior.

Ice: when it comes to big picture its 8 world cups for S. America, 8 for Europe, I would say it looks pretty even....

to ICE:

Brazil and Argentina are not the only good teams in South America, altought they are far supperior then say Uruguay and Peru, but Chile, Paraguay and Colombia are quite good to, just that they didn't have an exelent WC dosn't mean they're terrible. Colombia beat Argentina 3-0 at in Copa America and then was discualified by Chile 3-2 who later got discualified by Uruguay. But still they are good teams. Chile drew all their first round games in WC even the one against Italy, then they lost to Brazil. Paraguay beat Nigeria who beat Spain, then lost to France by a lucky goal, had they gone to penalties Paraguay may of won.

So if by decsent you meen team that win World Cups then Europe doesn't have so many either.


[This message has been edited by Bolso (edited 12-26-1999).]

Actually England did make football, in the Tudor times it was a game where the aim was to get the ball to another village by any means.

South American leagues may have presented Ronaldo, Romario, Garrincha, Cafu, Rivaldo to the world but most of them all left to go to... EUROPE BECAUSE THEY WANTED A CHALLENGE. If South American Leagues are sooo good then why dont the GOOD South Americans stay in South America. English players stay in England because they are already in a good league, the same goes for Italians (Baring those that move to England or Spain). Face it the South American leagues are Rubbish, they may have a few good players but they all move to Europe eventually. And if a league could be won by any team it shows that the teams are all weak and there are know outstanding teams.

Fact = World Cup Winners Europeans
Fact = World Club Champions Europeans
Fact = 3 best leagues in world European
Fact = Europe made football

You may have World player of the year (who plays in Europe), but the 2nd and 3rd were both European.

Fact = YLK is stupid (soorry guys but I couldn't resist)

I am Brazilian, You are? So stop to talk about something you don't know!
No one, No One! Players go to Europe for the challenge! They f*** off about the challenge!
You could want it, But they don't!
They only want the money! Money!!!
Challenge? Give me a time...

Fact = 8 WC for South and Europe
Fact = If you think that France was the better team at WC 98, and that Holland vs Brazil wasn't the real final, pity for you.

Now go play if your Santa toys!

For the rest - My 2 cents:
They are just diferent kind of players!
I like Laudrup very much!
And the second best player for me is Puskas!
But I think that Brazil and Argentina have more greatest players, not because they are better, but because 90% of Brazil and Argentina plays soccer!!
So make the counts: 161 Millions Brazlians 90% playing soccer against 40 Millions ( don't know the right number) Spanish 40% playing soccer.

Oh lord, please remember that results are exactly that. France beat Brazil, Holland ended 4th. I would have loved for Holland to have won it, but they didn't. One thing you can't argue is results, cause they are the only FACTS around. Whether it be by luck, or whatever, a win is a win, a draw a draw and a loss a loss.

Err... I am English, I have been to at least 200 English Premier League games, I have been to 6 Euro 96 International games and 3 International games of Le Tourne Wa (That tournament with France, Italy, Brazil and England), I have sky digital and I watch games from all over the world when I can.

You call me stupid, France V Brazil was the final of the World Cup of 1998 as far as I new... And France won that game 3-0.

Yes I accept the fact that players leave South America for the money, but still the point is that 90% of the good South Americans players leave the South American Leagues. Meaning they play in Europe and make the European Leagues better. The European Leagues are far better.

If the South Americn players were far better and and the South American leagues were better than the system would work the other way round Europeans would leave to go to South America for the money.

Though I kind of agree with your last statement.

Oh and if the Argentinian, Columbian, Chilian and other South American leagues (baring Brazil) are sooo good...

WHY ARENT THEY IN FIFA 2000

Instead of the Scottish, Swedish and Turkish leagues ect?

YLK why do you keep avoiding my question ??? also south american players dont leave south america and go to europe its not like they wake up one day and say i think i need more of a challenge so im going to europe...this is how it happens a euro team any team has a weak ass player in a certain position and they want a good player to take his spot so instead of looking in their own country to find one, they know that if they do he will be just as weak so they go to brazil and get a 16 year old kid with no shoes that can play way better and posses a certain flair that newspapers cant get enough of because you guys like reading this $hit and watching their highlights on t.v so that you can TRY to play like them,and offer him bags full of money so he can rock their club like its never been rocked before...in South America they dont need to spend lots of money to have a good team they just get kids from the streets since down here we eat,sleep,breath futbol and were born all ready knowing how to play while euro players have to pay money and go to footie school !!! ALSO WHEN IS SOMEONE GOING TO ANSWER MY QUESTION WHY DO EURO CLUBS HAVE TO DEPEND HEAVILY ON FOREIGN TALENT ??? SINCE THE BEGINING OF THE WORLD CUPS IT HAS BEEN (ITALY,GERMAY,HOLLAND,ENGLAND,FRANCE,)EUROPE VS BRAZIL AND ARGENINA 5 VS 2 AND ITS 8 CUPS A PIECE SO WHERES YOUR DOMINACE OH YEAH I FORGOT LOWLY URUGUAY WITH A POPULATION OF 10,000 AND THEY HAVE 2 WORLD CUPS MORE THAN ENGLAND FRANCE AND HOLLAND HE HE HE..

I dont take into count the ´66 world cup that England won. They bribed referees to won that one. So to me its:


South America 8 x Europe 7


YLK if you think that the only good players in South America are from Brazil or Argentina then you didnt watch France x Paraguai.

Also if Europe is so much better how come MANU didnt outscore Palmeiras, they only won because the referee didnt give that goal to Alex. And palmeiras didnt even qualify for the Brasileiro Finals.

If Manu played Corinthians (brasilian champs) they would get their asses kicked. And dont tell me Manu has better players because if that was true then Manu wouldnt be offering 40+Millions for Edilson a Corinthians Foward.

so?

I think you need to reread the rules and guidelines Italy82

[This message has been edited by Ric (edited 12-26-1999).]

Ric-"OK, my bad... I should say a number of you need to go reread the rules and guidelines!"

Its hard to follow the rules when your the only one trying to.

[This message has been edited by Ric (edited 12-26-1999).]

[This message has been edited by edu (edited 12-26-1999).]

I love South American football, I also love European football to. I dont get this whole South American versus European thing. Its pretty silly. Actually if you think about it, trying to claim Europeans are not as good as South Americans and South Americans are not as good as Europeans is basically an insult to the memories of all the unbelievably amazing players that both parts of the world have produced over the years. Players like Puskas, Eusibio, Baggio, Garincha, Socrates, Ardiles etc etc etc.
Juninhio, you have one huge chip on your shoulder, give it a rest.

YLK - How old are you? Are you trying to be dumb or are you too innocente??!?

If the South American clubs have more money then European doyou think that they will not buy the European great players?
And Do you really think that EA put Malasyan league and Sweden league beacuse they are better!
Open your eyes! It´s money!
Why MLS and no Argentina? Why Malasya and no Mexico?! Why the focus on Europe?!
Beep! You have 2 chances to anwser!

PS: Read again my post, I am not talking about who win the WC98. If you don´t get what I mean, sorry.

So you wanna talk best ever, hey?

SO South America have Maradona and Pele. And look at all the great players Europe have:

Beckenbauer
Yashin
Best
Charlton
Keegan
Zoff
Lineker
Eusebio
Cruyff
Muller
etc, etc, etc

And Goalkeepers:

Chilavert: Good
Dida: Crap
Roa: Terrible
heck, the keepers are sooo bad I don't even know them.

Europe has brilliant keepers like Schmeical, Van Der Sar, Buffon, Barthez, Seaman, etc.

---------------------------------------------

I think that even Asia/Africa dream team could beat south america.

Look into to the future, Brazil is already weakening with players like Dunga, Cesar Sampaio, and Taffarel gone. Players like Leonardo, Roberto Carlos, and Cafu are way passed their peak and will soon retire.

Best Keeper in the World: Schmeical

Best Defender in the World: Thuram

Best Midfielder in the World: Beckham/Zidane

Best Forward in the World: Bergkamp

Though, all South Americans will argue about this, it's the truth, so face the facts.

BOTTOM LINE, EUROPE ARE BETTER!!!!!!!

Don't be modest!
A Vietnam/New Zeland team could beat the South American Star team!

Tks! This week I get too much laugh! http://www.soccergaming.com/ubb/smile.gif

simonius_13 you seem like someone that knows very little about football.

Dida stops pretty much every penalty that he is faced with. AC Milan must really regret letting him go.

I agree Thuram is great, but South America has better wing backs by far.

Midfielders I have often said is a toss up sure Beck, Zid are great but for them we have Rivaldo and Veron.

I know a lot of you don't know much about Veron because he has yet to win any major awards and he is neither a pop star like Beckham, but believe me he was brought in to replace Vieri in the razzle dazzle department of Lazio.

Striker, Bergkamp is great but your saying he is much better than the likes of Batistuta, Crespo, Salas, Ronaldo etc??

What happened against Florentina?? Batastuta lead like a man possessed with only one goal: To win at all costs. Where was Bergkamp?

Juninhio...

Ac Milan did not let Dida go.

He is on LOAN to Corinthians.

AC Milan has his rights. They also own the best young Italian goalkeeper in Christian Abbiati.

better than Buffon??

I think it was a mistake. I've only seen one AC Milan game this season. Against Lazio 4 - 4. He looked weak in goal, but thats only one game I've seen.

I know your a fan of AC, but dont you think that they need a defender bad, i mean Maldini and Costacurta are aging fast.

Also their front is good but midfield is lagging too, the only excting player i've seen is Serghino.

Milan has many problems in defense, there is no question.

Abbiati saved the championship for Milan last season and will be a star.

Yes, you are correct, Buffon is very good as well and only one year older than Abbiati.

I think the future of the Milan National Team in goal are those two guys.

Mind if I but in on your Rossineri/Calcio banter?

Speaking of Italy's net-minders, let us not forget young Toldo. He is enourmous for Fiorentina! Italy's midfield may be s****** the life out of the national team - but the future of Italian goalkeeping is perhaps the most promising in the world!

As for Milan, perhaps the "Senators" are getting old, but Maldini, Costacorta, Albertini and George Weah are the soul of the team. They just need to "elect" some of the younger players to their senate.

Too bad Ba's form was destroyed in the red and black - for a Short time he was the most explosive winger in Europe.....

Duke...

I didn't include Toldo because he is 27.

Abbiati and Buffon are both 22.

I know that is being picky, but Toldo is in his prime, while the other two have just begun.

Italy without a doubt has the best young keepers in the world.

Similar to how Brazil has the best group of emerging left sided players in the world and france with centeral defenders.

Do you think it's fair to look to Argentina for creative central midfielders?

Pablito Aimar, Riquelme and San Lorenzo's Romanoli are unbelievable "babies" at this position.

Of course if you like older players, there are several European based players like PSG's Gallardo, Ariel Ortega and, of course, Juninhio's favorite, Juan Sebastian Veron....

The only thing that can make Italy win the Euro 2000 is the Buffon and Vieri.Vieri is the only guy who can score for Italy and maybe Inzaghi ,the midfield for Italy is their weekness and Buffon has perform like the way Pagliuca did in WC94 and 98.The defense will be strong,no doubt about that.

Juninhio,

I'm not suprised that sooooo many people want to ban you. Just look at ALL of these facts:

Man U won the Champions League and Toyota Cup-FACT

France won WC 1998-FACT

The are more teams in Euro than Copa America, ie it is better-FACT

All South American Leagues suck, why do all good players go to Europe-FACT

Europe has won more World Cups than South America has-FACT

The South American Team nearly always loses the Toyota Cup-FACT

Europe has better players, ie Beckham, Figo, Thuram, Schmeical, Owen, Bergkamp, Raul, Hierro, Hagi, Zidane, Figo, Rui Costa, Vieri, Abbiati, Van der Sar, Maldini, Overmars, Deschamps, Desailly, etc., etc., etc...-FACT

Europe has more all-time greats, ie Beckenbauer, Cruyff, Charlton, Best, Zoff, Eusebio, Keegan, Muller, Romario, Lineker, etc., etc., etc...-FACT

I know this war will never end, but Juninhio and co, just tell yourselves the truth.

-Simonius_13

Call the Cops!
Someone stole a WC from South America! Because last time it was 8 to Europe and 8 to South America!

And someone cheat the Toyota cups number too... Don't remember the right number but South American Clubs won more times.

Yes, the South American players go to Europe for the challenge...

Yes, only Europe have great players... Ronaldo? Suck. Veron? Suck, Amoroso? Suck? Salas? Suck...

Romario is now an European! And Pele, Maradona, Jairzinho, Rivelino, Kempes, Cubillas are not great players...

Simonius_13 try again! You could do it! I trust you! http://www.soccergaming.com/ubb/smile.gif

I do not agree with many of Juninhio post, but you need better arguments...

Gallardo is on AS Monaco, unless he just got transferred?

Why does everyone keep avoiding my question..???

What question?

What was your question Eduardo?

Polish,

Next thing your going to tell me Ginola doesn't play for PSG either?

Just kidding, Polish, that was just a typo about Gallardo (though to be honest, French games are hard to come by, and I have not seen him play for that fat, rich, resort squad. Remember how good Henry was when he played there? What happened?)

Still, I don't know how many of you watch the Argentine league (now over, River!!!!) but it seems like half of the teams in the league have a baby faced demon of a dribbler wearing number "10".

Thanks for keeping my facts straight....

everyone just admit it, south america has produced the "Higher Quality" players...eg:ronaldo, maradona, pele, di stefano plus many, many more...south america generally produces better players, but europe has the stronger leagues...south americans are TECHNICALLY better, but soccer is not all about technique...english league for example is a physical league, italian league is a defensive league...skill is only one of many necessities needed to be a great soccer player...u need strength, speed, stamina, brains, and many other things too...technique isnt what its all about

Duke,
John Collins Certinly Starred at Monaco and he`s come back with the great skills he left with, oh and a tan. He really looks out of place in the Scottish National team standing next to all these pale scotsmen.

Wow Christos, I could not have put it better myself. There are better defensive teams, more physical teams but yes I agree with the techincal part too.

Be careful Christos,

While what you say has general merit it is not really fare to Soccer playing community. Platini and George Best come to mind. Lord knows Northern Ireland is not supplying the World's leagues with technically gifted professional, but Besty could do anything with a ball. Anything!

What about current ball artists like Ginola and Del Piero? Let's give a shout out to the Africans - have you ever seen Mustafa Hadji's ball control?

Please don't misconstrue me as a partisan player - I love the game world wide, partly because of the MANY NATIONAL CHARACTERISTICS which your post aptly points out.

Where he (she?) comes from will have a great influence on how a player is developed, but footballers are footballers, what a player does on the field defines his abilities and technique.

By the way, Ed, what was your question?

Duke,
No problem, some guy also said Poland won the U-17 Euro champpionship this year, but I let that little mistake just slide!!!

I saw Monaco-Bastia few weeks back, but I know what you mean French league is not exactly easy to get access to.

I dont get it why is everyone picking on Henry I dont think he's all that bad.

Goonerboy,

I love John Collins. I watched him and Scotland outplay England in the two legs of the Euro playoff. Collins' technical abilities were apparent as he continued to chip away at the English left side.

Isn't it strange how Scotland is consistently an outstanding qualification team, but England play tough in the tournaments (if they get there.)

Polish, I saw some of the U17 tourny. Poland were hard done by. My friend Izzy says Poland's youth squads continue to be outstanding but politics and poor infrastructure have plagued the senior side. (Oh yeah, and Sweden too...Ouch!)

Oh, by the way Goonerboy, did Collins have the best abs in football before he went to Monaco, or did he work on that for beach looks?

My question is simple..Why do European clubs rely heavily on foreign talent...the majority of the top european clubs field like 75% foreigners.example Barcelona they have half of the holland national side and a portuguse,brazilian and two spaniards...i know that this make the teams stronger and more exciting but thats besides the point..keep in mind that the argument was that Europe had more talented players than south america (note the key word is more not better) so i got to pondering if they (Europe) have so many talented players why do clubs from any the top four leagues are all ways looking abroad for players and they dont get two or three they get from 6-11...so there you have it MY QUESTION ? and i dont want to hear about the lower divisions or youth squads because the only players that you hear about are the starting 11...and i will gladly answer any questions regarding "MY Question"

Duke - What christos says is that South America made MORE quality players, that always was SA strenght.
Europe make great players too, but SA made more. Every year you see anothr future star from Brazil: Ronaldinho Gaucho this year, Fabio Junior last year and Amoroso in 97.

South Amrican players are weak,bottom line.

And you are weak of brain!

Edoardo,

What does the fact that Barca has a million Dutch players have to do with whether Europe has more good players than S.A? Correct me if I am wrong, but players from the European Union are not considered "foreign" by the leagues in the European Union. Because of this rule change, teams can sign alot of players from different countries without having to worry about the three foreigner rule.

If players from the European Union are not considered foreign, then I do not see your argument. Look at a typical Arsenal lineup--
Seaman; Keown, Dixon, Adams, Winterburn; Vieira, Petit, Overmars, Parlor, Kanu, Suker. There are only two foreigners in this lineup-- Kanu (Nigeria) and Suker (Croatia) even though there are only 5 Englishman (GK and the 4 Defenders). I think Barcelona often only starts one "foreigner" Rivaldo). Although Chelsea last night fielded five: Thome, Babayaro, Petrescu, Poyet, Flo (is Norway considered foreign?).

If your argument is that Spain and England rely on non-Spainards and non-Englishmen, then I agree 100 percent. But to say that the top clubs in Europe are "carried" by S.A. players I think is a bit much.

Junhinio is drunk.

BlueMoon: i did mean non english players in premiere non spaniards in la liga and non italians in serie A calcio...and i never said south americans carry euro clubs all though sometimes they do like piojo lopez in Valencia, Maradona when he was in Napoli, Batistuta in Firenza,Rivaldo in Barcelona,Gallardo in Monaco...

Edoardo the short answer is they buy those players because they want to win, it doesnt matter where he comes from, if they think he's good they want him.

Everyone has completely overlooked the best goalkeeper ever - Banks

(by the way, he came from.. England)

Oh yeah - Seaman is also one of the best, but Schmeical is definetly up there.

(by the which way, both came from England)

I think Italy82 is mad at Brazilians cause they beat Italy in 94, and Italy hasnt been the same since. While Brazil still achieves success, with or with out a fully fit Ronaldo.
Simonius_13, South American players do not leave South America only for the challenge, but because they get paid in ENGLISH POUNDS!! That is why they leave. Why are South American players, not only getting transfered to European clubs, but they are doing it at a more expensive rate. Simeone went to Lazio int he Vieri deal for 11 million pounds. Martin Palermo is supposed to be joining Lazio in January for 15 million pounds or something like that. The guy couldnt hit a penalty shot to save his country, and he is still worth 15 mil. Ronaldinhio is most likely going to break Vieri's transfer record (unless Barca does something stupid, like selling Rivaldo).

All you guys who say South American players suck, why are so many South American players on the top teams in Europe? Why do so many clubs break their bank account to get them? ManU was willing to buy out Rivaldo's contract if Rupert Murdoch took over team. (his buyout clause is 75 million pounds) They are still interested in him for 36 million. Ronaldo would still go for about 30 million. What do you think BatiGOL would go for??? Why would people pay that much for South American talent?? They can't suck, so they must be GOOD!! All this talk is just bias toward South America. European players are good, some excellent (Van Nistelrooy, Manchester United, Bergkamp), but South America has consistently produced the same amount of superstars that Europe has produced. Their can't be much of a difference in quality, so why the hostility??

Woody whats your point ,teams like Lazio,barca etc..have money to spend ,so they spend it on crappy brazilian players.

Calm down Italy82!
It is hard but you will forget...
Do not let the angry wins, Let the Force be with you...

http://www.soccergaming.com/ubb/smile.gif

Eduardo... European teams dont need South Americans... The English league has been one of the best (if not the best) league in the world since it was formed in the last century, and we hardly imported any South Americans until around 1994. Our league was fine without them and the only reason we go to South America to look for talent is because of the prices that you can get for good players.

When Middlesbrough bought Juninho first time round he was Brazilian player of the year and the hottest young South American talent around (Baring Ronaldo who had already been snapped up by PSV). We got him for 4.5 million. If you wanted to buy the hottest young English talent then you would have to pay at least 10 million.

Another example is Middlesbrough's recent purchase of Carlos Marinelli, In Argentina he was dubbed 'The New Maradona' we bought him for 1.5 million. If England had a player dubbed the new Charlton, Keegan or Moore he would be at least worth 4 million.

Notice how Manchester United have a team built from Europeans because they do not need to make cheep purchases.

This may not apply to all European leagues but it applies to the English league.

Oh and Goohnerboy, I didn't actually know that Scotland made football but I think that they do kick ass and they certainley deserved to go to Euro 2000 instead of England.

Like YLK said they are worth not much .How much did Palermo did in Argentina ?Not much .Anyways Palermo wont play much in Lazio cause theres already Salas,Ravanelli and Bocksic.Like I said they have money to spend so they buy anyone.

Like YLK said ,Brazilian players are not worth as much as european players .How much did Palermo make in Argentina ?Not much.Anyways Palermo wont play that much in Lazio cause theres already Salas,Ravanelli and Bocksic.Like I said earlier ,Rich teams have money to spend .

But Palermo is more skilled than all of them. He broke an argentina league record held by one Gabriel Batistuta. Besides Sinja M. takes all penalties and Palermo is complete from all other aspects except not as much pace. He is better than S. Inzaghi, A Boksic, Mancini and Ravellini. Maybe not as good as Salas yet but in time can be even better.

That's pretty funny Italy82 .... but it still shows that you have no real intelligence. If they are crappy, why do teams spend so much money on them?? Why are so many South American players sought after? From Veron, to Rivaldo, Ronaldinhio. geez .... would look at this from a non-biased point of view.

That's pretty funny Italy82 .... but it still shows that you have no real intelligence, becuase you didnt answer my question. If they are crappy, why do teams spend so much money on them?? Why are so many South American players sought after? They can't be crappy if they are worth so many millions. From Veron, to Rivaldo, Santa Cruz, Palermo, Ronaldinhio. geez .... would u look at this from a non-biased point of view.

Look I think personally that Europeans are just as good as South Americans. And you are right in saying that some South Americans do cost alot but this is after they have moved to Europe, or in one case Denilson because he made his name quite big in Le Tourne Wa. In general Brazilians can cost alot but Europeans cost quite a bit to you know... Vieri 32 million, Shearer 15 million, Michael Owen is insured for 60 million and there are many more.
Anyhow the English Premier League spends more money than any other league (its a fact from last seasons annual turnover) and we have very few South Americans who cost much.
As for Palmero he will probably get a team place due to the age of Ravanelli and Bocksic but only time will tell.

Did anyone else notice how big this argument has become... Pretty cool huh!!!

Actually Vieri is paid 46 million .But i still agree with YLK.

Viere is paid 46 million? in what currency? you do know that the transfer fee has just about nothing to do with what the player is "paid", right?

Polish ,Vieri is the highest paid player in the italian league .

Polish, Italy,

I just thought a few numbers might help you guys out. Vieri IS NOT the highest paid player in Italy, Del Piero is. It is close though:

1. Del Piero, Juventus - £69,230
2. Vieri, Inter - £55,769
3. Ronaldo, Inter - £50,000
4. Veron, Lazio - £48,076
5. F. Inzaghi, Juventus - £41,208

*all numbers represent WEEKLY wages in pounds sterling.
Source: World Soccer

Vieri does hold the record for a TRANSFER fee, in addition to being the second highest paid player in the world.

Hope this helps.
Cheers.