Found the following image rather interesting. Shows the distribution of money from TV rights.

http://c0013884.cdn1.cloudfiles.rackspacecloud.com/x2_7671ef4

The last placed team in the premier league earned more then the third place team in Spain. Odd distribution.

even though as a Barca fan, i really don't like the tv rights in Liga BBVA, it's really stupid to be honest

You saw the article a day or two ago about Liverpool thinking about trying to get the Premiership to move to the Spanish model?

Apparently the good people of Kuala Lumpur love them some Liverpool.

well the Premier League in an entity on its own, and was started on the basis of a TV deal, with more equalized shares for its "shareholders" as part of its "corporate" model, which would run independent to the country's lower leagues ...

all other nations have their federation funding all footballing tiers, with TV deals allowed to be negotiated on a club-by-club basis ...

the only reason the Premier League model was successfully implemented is because most of the world is anglophone ... after carving out its market share, the hype and marketing has been ported to other languages ...

Del Nido has been railing against the LFP for the past two years over this. It's got to change.

Liverpool should get off their high horse its not like their winning titles anyway. :borat:

The Spanish system looks broken too me, how are other teams supposed to compete, Barca and Madrid getting £100 mil more then the next team. Unfair advantage?

I can see Liverpools point of view though... they want the money their fans generate.

You either have it fairer from the leagues point of view or fairer for the clubs point of view.

Their again you could do a Man City and balance the odds that way :D

The Spanish system looks broken too me, how are other teams supposed to compete, Barca and Madrid getting £100 mil more then the next team. Unfair advantage?

It's not even JUST that, there are like 14 Spanish clubs without shirt sponsors because of the tv deal situation. I mean, VALENCIA can't even secure a shirt sponsor.

It's not even JUST that, there are like 14 Spanish clubs without shirt sponsors because of the tv deal situation. I mean, VALENCIA can't even secure a shirt sponsor.

That really is quite unbelievable isn't it, crazy.

It's not even JUST that, there are like 14 Spanish clubs without shirt sponsors because of the tv deal situation. I mean, VALENCIA can't even secure a shirt sponsor.

I didn't know that. How do they generate money then? I'd love to know there operating income... I guess its quite amazing what they can do with there funds.

Sponsorship and TV rights must be huge.

Barcelona fans choosing not to comment.....

Haha! Just say something about that time Messi kicked the ball against a supporter, they'll jump straight in here.

I think they need to change something, would hate to see the entire league go bank rupt or lose spots in UCL. Del Nido makes another comment today about it, seems it might be getting more serious...

I think a reform would affect Real more than us, we have the cantera and I don't see players like Messi, Iniesta, Cesc, Busquets, Piquenbauer, etc leaving because the club must lower salaries.

Madrid on the other hand will lose at least Cristiano, maybe Benzema, Ozil, Kaka, Mourinho. Can't imagine how much CR7 will cry if he falls in second to Messi in wages too, what's that leave him with his looks? :rofl:

Barcelona fans choosing not to comment.....

Fair distribution mate (H)

Madrid and Barcelona would do just fine with a smaller cut. They would still have a massive advantage over other teams due to ticket sales, merchandise, sponsorships, etc. They don't need 10 times the TV revenue as well.

I agree. Really the whole two team domination is hurting the league in my opinion.

Still, i don't think the rest of the teams would challenge the title with a fair distribution, Barça and Madrid are just too good. They would compete better though. Hope Málaga make some crazy signings next windows.

They couldn't compete in the next couple years, but in the long run they would be competitive.

Madrid and Barcelona will not be topped anytime soon, but that's because they have the money to keep getting better each year, distancing themselves farther from the rest of the league.

A better distribution of money from TV rights could go a long ways. Teams could invest more in their youth systems, have a better shot of keeping their homegrown players, and could make some quality signings. Better teams means a few more draws and losses for the top two, and maybe some seasons we could have a surprise like Valencia and Depor back in the days. Of course Madrid and Barcelona have no interest in this.

It's surprising to me that they seem to have so many patsies voting for the status quo at the little clubs. I know Sevilla, Villarreal, and Valencia are against the current system, but amazingly it seems like a non-starter in Spain. You'd think the vote would be 18-2 every time, but I don't think that's how it is.

Its the advantage in Europe not just the domestic league as well which is a factor.

72 million more then united for example... Whats that... the price of Ronaldo lol

Exactly. Even UEFA should oversee that. Yet UEFA touching Barça is not going to happen.

I guess the only excuse is that Barca and Real have way more game time on TV, so deserve to get more? Don't agree, but I presume that's their viewpoint.

Dan, apparently most clubs are contractually obliged until 2014 to stick with the new deal, so I wonder if a few don't bother voting the other way due to that?

Very strange situation.

Barca and Real dominate Spanish sports news in such a way that even their training sessions get more coverage than some first division matches It's unfair that they get more money, but they get that money because they get more coverage, and they get more coverage because it's what the majority want to see. It's what the people want to see because they're the better clubs, and they're the better clubs, in part, because they have a lot more money. Goes around in circles.

You'd think the vote would be 18-2 every time, but I don't think that's how it is.and where is this "vote" taking place?

people seem to be missing the real picture as to how the Premier League model works, vs. other leagues ... my previous post (link (http://www.soccergaming.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3126978&postcount=5)) would have helped shed some light, but sadly it's been overlooked and the discussion continues on fairly ignorant terms ...

Your point is irrelevant. It doesn't matter why the Premiership's model worked, it's working now, and as shown by the pic (assuming that data is correct), other leagues have similar structure, such as the Bundesliga, to which your point doesn't apply. It's definitely possible for the clubs to work out a similar structure, just like these other leagues have done.

Your post was just your expected criticism of the Premiership, which is why it was ignored. This isn't a thread about the Premiership, but about La Liga, which is the exception here, since the other leagues all have similar TV rights structures, so no one missed how the Prem is different to other leagues, it just didn't matter.

EDIT: You could make the case that those other leagues aren't successful because the clubs earn significantly less than the Prem clubs, due to the Prem's popularity. Still doesn't matter because the money that the Spanish league would have to distribute would the same, just divided differently between the clubs. They might not be as rich as Prem clubs, but it's certainly a big difference that would help out smaller Spanish clubs to level the playing field and make the league more interesting.

In summation, the argument here is that the total amount money from TV rights the Spanish league gets should be distributed better among the clubs, which is a discussion that is independent from the Prem, so I don't see where the ignorance is coming from.

Exactly. Even UEFA should oversee that. Yet UEFA touching Barça is not going to happen.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-yxJ0Z9Y2F0k/Thc5bp80_DI/AAAAAAAAA4Y/3AiWR0b0L7s/s1600/Mou-its-a-conspiracy-777615.jpg

It's definitely not a conspiracy. That would imply some sort of secrecy.

and where is this "vote" taking place?

There have been recent meetings. Maybe it's not a 1 team 1 vote thing. Asshole.

people seem to be missing the real picture as to how the Premier League model works, vs. other leagues ... my previous post (link (http://www.soccergaming.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3126978&postcount=5)) would have helped shed some light, but sadly it's been overlooked and the discussion continues on fairly ignorant terms ...

It was an ignorant post because you assumed all other leagues operate like Spain. Germany and France don't, and I think Italy has just recently collectivized as well. But by all means, I'm sure this is enough of a springboard for you to condescend away in a 5000 word post.

There have been recent meetings. Maybe it's not a 1 team 1 vote thing. Asshole.

It was an ignorant post because you assumed all other leagues operate like Spain. Germany and France don't, and I think Italy has just recently collectivized as well. But by all means, I'm sure this is enough of a springboard for you to condescend away in a 5000 word post.no the point is that the Premier League was formed to create such a unified forum where such issues were dealt with in unison ... this is not the case in Spain, or France, or Germany ...

without such an agreed-upon platform to resolve league-wide issues, such votes in Spain would hold little sway on deciding anything -- they'd merely bring attention to the issue, which they have been successful in doing; doesn't mean things are going to change any time soon ...

and yes, Italy are actively trying, with little success so far ...

but like I said in my first post in this thread, the success of the Premier League model lay with the fact that this world is largely anglophone (not italophone) ...

Yeah, yeah, the Prem's success/popularity is thanks to outside factors and not its quality, the Prem sucks blah blah. This has nothing to do with this discussion, it's just your excuse to make your opinion known and criticise the Prem, as you are propense to do.

Anyway, two random thoughts:

- I'd love to see the other 18 clubs reach an agreement and refuse to play Barca and Real. They'd lose the matches (which doesn't matter since everyone would lose and they were going to get the top two spots anyway) and get fines (which would be balanced by the extra money that would hopefully come from this extreme measure. With no matches to play, I'm sure the TV companies would re-negotiate. Not sure if this would be legal though, and it definitely won't happen, but if the players can strike, why not the clubs?

- I recently read an article about how English clubs wants some laws changed so they can get more time with their youth players, who currently have much less training hours than their European counterparts. This has lead to foreign youngsters being much more developped at a younger age. On the other hand, English club's financial advantage allows them to buy better players when they're developped, so in overly simplistic terms the playing field is sort of level. Would be much nicer if everyone had the ability to develop great youngsters as well as spending power.

Yeah, yeah, the Prem's success/popularity is thanks to outside factors and not its quality, the Prem sucks blah blah. This has nothing to do with this discussion, it's just your excuse to make your opinion known and criticise the Prem, as you are propense to do.if you actually read my posts, you'd know my opinion of the Prem's style has nothing to do with my points on the Premier League model and their relevance to this discussion ...

I did read your posts. It was nothing but veiled criticism of the Prem, to justify it's success without giving it merit, and you did it even thought it had nothing to do with the discussion or the point your were trying to make, twice. Either you think you're not as transparent as you are or you just don't realise how much of an agenda-driven person you are, but whichever it is, I don't care.

what?

1) League-wide issues are agreed upon by all league teams, and only league teams:
- Premier League model? YES
- Others? NO

2) Marketing of 'the product' has to do with knowledgeable match commentary (which entails people from that nation), magazine shows, and interviews accessible without translation to the largest possible market base:
- In the English language? YES
- In Other languages? NO


RELEVANCE:
- point 1 has to do with why Blackpool got more TV revenue than Valencia
- point 2 has to do with how the world works when it comes to entertainment: it's not just about the football, it's how it is presented, and how accessible players and experts are -- language is the key! this is turn influences why immediate demand for English-language programs is high, and why programming in other languages wouldn't be ...

Which is all fine, but the main issue here is Barcelona and Real getting all the cash and the rest of the teams getting nothing in comparison. This is what's been discussed here, and this has nothing to do with anything you've said because it's an issue that's internal to the Spanish league. You were complaining about people continuing to discuss the issue on ignorant terms, but the fact is that most of us have been discussing a different issue to the one you've focused on.

disagree that it's a different issue:
the Premier League [...] was started on the basis of a TV deal, with more equalized shares for its "shareholders" as part of its "corporate" model, which would run independent to the country's lower leagues ...this ^ was in 1991, and since then the growth of TV revenue numbers has been exponential!

not only do I think that such an accord will be close to impossible to agree upon with today's valuations, but I wonder how long the big Premier League teams can/will resist similar lucrative package deals to that of Madrid and Barcelona ...

****'s sake. The Prem's TV rights structure is hardly different from Germany's, so it's not a Prem issue, it's Spain where things need to change so the money is distributed more fairly. Stop making it about the Prem, that's not what this is about.

Agree, Xifio you're just talking about something no one else is talking about (or interested in).

I made 2 points:

1) about a collective platform for a league's teams to discuss and resolve issues
2) about language: English vs. others

I was referring to the Spanish teams agreeing a deal considering today's numbers, and not having a platform to have 20 team vote ... this ties into point #1 ...

the Bundesliga selling collective rights falls into point #2 -- language!

both points relevant and pertinent? I think so ...

Hey

Y U NO TALK ABOUT PORTUGAL :(

- I recently read an article about how English clubs wants some laws changed so they can get more time with their youth players, who currently have much less training hours than their European counterparts. This has lead to foreign youngsters being much more developped at a younger age. On the other hand, English club's financial advantage allows them to buy better players when they're developped, so in overly simplistic terms the playing field is sort of level. Would be much nicer if everyone had the ability to develop great youngsters as well as spending power.

I saw that, something to do with the amount of hours kids are allowed to work. To stop exploitation of children etc. Other countries have that advantage over us as the hours there allowed to work are so much higher, like days more.

But anyway... I'm doing a Xifio and turning this into a prem thread when its really all about fairer distribution in Spain like most other countries do. it needs to be fixed.

The more I think about it the more mad it sounds that Liverpool wanted this.

Premiership has a bright future with individual TV contracts and the abolishment of relegation.

lol abolishment of relegation... I wonder which crack pots came up with that idea... my guess some billionaires from America, who use the system.