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CGFE Being "Not As Good As CM"

tinpanalley

tinpanalley

Youth Team
Just an opinion here, please dont think I'm judging anyone, it's just a few words on something I'm seeing a lot of on several FIFA related forums that is becoming rampant when people get irritated that they can't make the modification they want in their FIFA game. I'm just prefacing with this because forums have a way of making people sound colder than they are, so yes, I'm singling out people who say CM was "better" than CGFE, but I'm not criticising them for it. (gotta be careful what you say online now...)

CGFE was not made as an 'easier improvement' to CM16. So to say CM16 was easier is sort of not the point. That we have a tool at ALL is the point. The people who worked on CGFE didn't sit and say "let's see... how do we make a tool that's better than CM16?" they said "how the hell do we make a tool AT ALL that edits this infernally locked FIFA 18?". It also bears remembering that because something is newer, it doesn't necessarily follow that they have to always be improvements and to that end I think CGFE is getting a lot of criticism from people who in actual fact, when you look behind the frustration, don't want to take the time to figure it out.

I have sat for weeks now and just failed one test after another trying to make things work for me because someone here has very kindly answered questions I've tried to formulate in intelligent ways and he's been kind enough to guide me, not by the hand at all, but by pointing at things for me to try. What that's done is made me try, and then fail, and then eventually get it or at least begin to understand how it works. Maybe I'm not as skilled in this as others but I see the exact CM16 I used to use in CGFE. It's there. You just have to save your progress in a different way that's all, be it as a completed mod or a an individual cgm file. In fact, the ability CGFE provides of making a tweak that you can apply and then instantly discard if it doesn't work without affecting your install folder is one of the most brilliant things about it and I would argue that's actually a massive improvement to CM.

Anyway, again, I'm not an expert, I barely know how to use it but it's unfair to say it isn't good or that it's difficult. Plus, and I thnik this is the biggest point, it's also free. And it significantly improves the game. And that's worth a little effort on our part to try it, really try it, before criticising.
 
qasar80

qasar80

Youth Team
With atention and patience all is working just nice.
Just needs several tries to understand the steps needed and after it's just without problems.
Excelent thinf is that files can be loaded on top of another, replacing themselfes or just adding, where there was none, so it's just perfect, to combine two or more patches.
I have versions for bundesliga and premier league with specific adboards, dressing, edited teams.
 
marcas

marcas

Youth Team
tinpanalley said:
... Plus, and I thnik this is the biggest point, it's also free...
Click to expand...

This! It's easy to criticize, but if it's free, one can only be grateful for every little tool or help that is provided. If someone wants a special request or feature, that someone should be able to put their money where their mouth is... I have done this before, and donated money for work that I wanted to be done - and it paid off - I got what I wanted (paid) for. So again, as long as it's free, just be grateful and show your support in any way possible. Contribute or share your work, or anything else positive that I didn't think of mentioning.
 
regularcat

regularcat

Manager
Moderator
Works fine for me, if they don't like it use Frosty or don't mod your game. All I know is I am glad I am not shawminator. He has walked away and keeps quiet rather than replying
to people who post negatively about a free tool. Too much of his time and effort were spent on building a tool 80% of people complain about.

This place is full of ungrateful people, a bunch of give me, give me types always looking for a handout. If it was myself as soon as you put your hand out I'd chop it off at the wrist. I am pretty much done with this place and this community.
 
tinpanalley

tinpanalley

Youth Team
I worked once for a startup and was involved in community support, forums, social media, etc. It was a crappy browser product but I learned a lot about interacting with communities in these kinds of environments. For a few years now I've been thinking about opening a REALLY basic (like, reeeally basic) forum/blog type site where people who really want to fine-tune and share minutiae of modding different sports games could unite with the goal of having a place for people with modding know-how or interest who also know about and love sports to get together. The blog element would allow for people who write and like to expand on things to express their views too (guilty as charged with always posting wordy things :blush:). Any "where is my" or "give me" attitude would be discouraged from the get-go. I see LOTS of really old forum platforms still around in really niche-y topics where you are basically made to participate or risk losing your account. It works. The community actually sticks together. Just an idea, of course, and I can't really afford financially to not work to start up something like that. But I'm getting a bit sick of all this as well and I'm now at a point where I only interact with a small group in each sports game forum I go to.
I'd love to do it, though.
 
marcas

marcas

Youth Team
I don't think that the majority is complaining though... on the contrary... Think about it... How often do you hear about a friend who walked into a 7-eleven, bought an apple, and everything went as it should - end of story? (Boring story)... = NEVER... When all is good, people usually don't say shit.

But if the same guy tried to buy an apple, and the cashier called him a dickhead for not buying anything else, you would without a doubt hear about that. What I'm saying is that people who run into issues are more likely to "kick and scream" about it, compared to people who found no issues at all.

IMO I'm not a big believer in "closed communities", because I still believe that the games and tools would "lose its value" if the fans wasn't able to use them. Sure maybe you don't give a shit if you just use it for your own good... but a large amount of the patches are made for the public, and let's be honest; we have ALL enjoyed patches, mods, or whatever, that someone ELSE made - and it was free. This "beautiful game" wouldn't be much without the fans anyway... We just have to learn how to "brush dust off our shoulders", and encourage the positive in each other.

Peace & Love :rhizome:
 
B

bangus

Starting XI
marcas said:
I don't think that the majority is complaining though
Click to expand...
That is correct. The vast majority download and use the tool, and never post unless they are having issues. Past that, I can't remember reading one post where someone actually stated that CGFE is broken or useless.

It's not about complaining really. A few people who appear to have little knowledge of the tools have expressed frustration at not being able to figure out how to use them. Some have even complained I suppose. But most of that is from people who signed up yesterday and have like 2 posts. Which explains things, because CGFE requires reading the threads to figure out how to use the bug workarounds. That's all. I just tell them to read, or help them out, or link them up to my tutorials.
 
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B

bangus

Starting XI
What I see are people complaining about editing, and not about the tools. Most people come here to grab a file and then never come back. They want it right now; that's how the Internet works for most. They don't want to take time to learn to edit. They're unhappy about that.
 
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tinpanalley

tinpanalley

Youth Team
marcas said:
OK, Maybe my thoughts are just "wishful" thinking... :blush: I just hoped it isn't as bad as it was described in this thread.
Click to expand...
No, no, your thoughts are completely valid. Don't say that. :) But the fact that I see it that way doesn't mean you're wrong for not seeing it like that. I don't personally see it as just a few people. I see it as a large quantity of people. And I see it on at least six other sports gaming forums for different games and for different tools or tweaks. I'm not gonna go digging around for copy-paste examples here and on moddingway and other FIFA related sites but there are several comments that are some variation of "CM was so much better". If people don't think that it's like that, then great.

I've had enough of seeing it and the entitlement, I think others have too, and I'm just expressing that frustration. I'm not suggesting people are wrong if they don't see it or that my opinion is more valid than any other. Just one man's observation. I'm not talking about the number of people in the world that download CGFE and try it, I'm only referring to those who post about it. You see people like @msrajjc2 constantly asking questions, trying things out, figuring out why they don't work, then sharing his progress. That's great! But he's not in the majority. And I don't think some of us would find the typical interactions here as frustrating if there were more people like him here. I guess I see things more as @regularcat expressed it. That's fine, the world's big enough for lots of opinions and views.

Thanks for the good responses, guys.
 
qasar80

qasar80

Youth Team
But, in the essence, CGFE has creation master inside, so why people say it's not as good as CM?
It has CM, DB master anf file explorer all in one so it is a pointless afirmation.
Surely anyone who has basic knowledge of modding knows the game engine has changed in 2017 along with the entire format of files so the fact that we have three modding tools from the glory days of fifa 16 is nothing short of a miracle. The only difference is the imposibility of adding new files which I believe will be added sooner rather than later and used in fifa 19. Also maybe a tool for stadium creators would come in handy but the format is so different it's very hard to make such a tool.
Ofcourse, the working of any tool is influenced by every individual pc and os so it's obvious there will be people who won't be able to run it as it's the case with Frosty Editor also but there are a feew steps that can be taken to increase the chances of succes with enough will.
Also on the forum there are kids too, teenagers, which do not have the knowledge or the patience to learn, so they just scream....that's the situation and can be hardly changed.
 
marcas

marcas

Youth Team
qasar80 said:
...
Also on the forum there are kids too, teenagers, which do not have the knowledge or the patience to learn, so they just scream....that's the situation and can be hardly changed.
Click to expand...

Yeah, keep in mind that kids these days grow up in world where there is an app for everything! :p
They expect instant delivery or confirmation on everything, and they want it NOW!...
 
qasar80

qasar80

Youth Team
marcas said:
Yeah, keep in mind that kids these days grow up in world where there is an app for everything! :p
They expect instant delivery or confirmation on everything, and they want it NOW!...
Click to expand...
There are a lot of things that I want right now in my life but that's not gonna happen. Patience is a virtue and it comes with time so the younger the user, the more impatient...as it is said "good things come to those who wait".
 
22fifa

22fifa

Club Supporter
tinpanalley said:
Just an opinion here, please dont think I'm judging anyone, it's just a few words on something I'm seeing a lot of on several FIFA related forums that is becoming rampant when people get irritated that they can't make the modification they want in their FIFA game. I'm just prefacing with this because forums have a way of making people sound colder than they are, so yes, I'm singling out people who say CM was "better" than CGFE, but I'm not criticising them for it. (gotta be careful what you say online now...)

CGFE was not made as an 'easier improvement' to CM16. So to say CM16 was easier is sort of not the point. That we have a tool at ALL is the point. The people who worked on CGFE didn't sit and say "let's see... how do we make a tool that's better than CM16?" they said "how the hell do we make a tool AT ALL that edits this infernally locked FIFA 18?". It also bears remembering that because something is newer, it doesn't necessarily follow that they have to always be improvements and to that end I think CGFE is getting a lot of criticism from people who in actual fact, when you look behind the frustration, don't want to take the time to figure it out.

I have sat for weeks now and just failed one test after another trying to make things work for me because someone here has very kindly answered questions I've tried to formulate in intelligent ways and he's been kind enough to guide me, not by the hand at all, but by pointing at things for me to try. What that's done is made me try, and then fail, and then eventually get it or at least begin to understand how it works. Maybe I'm not as skilled in this as others but I see the exact CM16 I used to use in CGFE. It's there. You just have to save your progress in a different way that's all, be it as a completed mod or a an individual cgm file. In fact, the ability CGFE provides of making a tweak that you can apply and then instantly discard if it doesn't work without affecting your install folder is one of the most brilliant things about it and I would argue that's actually a massive improvement to CM.

Anyway, again, I'm not an expert, I barely know how to use it but it's unfair to say it isn't good or that it's difficult. Plus, and I thnik this is the biggest point, it's also free. And it significantly improves the game. And that's worth a little effort on our part to try it, really try it, before criticising.
Click to expand...

Count your blessings, if these creators that enable us to use tools to mod FIFA decide to stop, we're done for good. We will be back to just boring conventional FIFA gameplay and whatever crumbs EA wants to feed us. I want to thank all the creators and modders for making this possible year after year despite the obstacles. Frostbite engine disabled the ability to mod FIFA for months when it was first introduced in FIFA 17. These masters of modding in our community took time out of their regular lifes to figure out a way around frostbite engine. Needless to say, thanks regular cats for dedicating your time to answering questions that have already been answered by you as well elsewhere in this forum lol!
 
tinpanalley

tinpanalley

Youth Team
22fifa said:
Count your blessings...
Click to expand...
Well, yes, that is more or less my point with regards to being sick of people demanding help without trying themselves or flat out criticising our awesome tools we have without fully trying them. So THEY're the ones that need to count their blessings, not me.
 
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