FC Barcelona Thread [2009/10]

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Pogba4Now

Team Captain
Dytza;2787829 said:
Even if Ronaldo would play in Barcelona I'd nev er say he's better and more complete than Messi.
Messi more complete? Give me a break. Messi is better than Ronaldo on some aspects like dribbling and as you said teamwork. But there are many aspects in which Ronaldo is better. Headers, strength, power, long shots, freekicks etc. Don't get me wrong, I am not saying that Ronaldo's better, but he's definitely more complete. I admire Messi as a player more than Ronaldo though...

Dytza;2787829 said:
Leo has something Ronaldo doesn't. TEAM-WORK!
Thats only one thing that you mentioned. How about the aspects I mentioned above? I know its one of the most important aspects in football but you cannot call someone a complete player just because he's got team-work. Team work is not the only quality that an ideal player should have.

Dytza;2787829 said:
Another important thing between the two players is that Messi is capable of huge things espacially in the big matches, and I can give you a lot of examples only this year (El Clasico - he scored 3 in the two games las season, 1/8 CL he scored against OL, 1/4 CL he scored twice against Bayern, CL Final he scored again United with a headder (which is one of the things many people consider him not capable of), CDL final he scored the 1-2 goal against Athletic, European Supercup - he made a great assist for Pedro in the 115th min., Supercopa - He scored in the 2nd leg and WCC - he scored a chest goal (!) in the extra-time and was named the best player of the tournament!). That's something we can be proud of, because Messi scored in the best moments for us this season.
Agreed with this one. Ronaldo also is capable of doing that as he proved against Chelsea in the UCL final, against Arsenal numerous times etc but I still think that Messi is a bit better than Ronaldo when it comes to the big games.
 

Arnau

NGR LVR
Messi scores in everyfinal and most of classicos its much more decisive than ronaldo wich isn't better header than messi, its just taller.
 

kp41

Fan Favourite
his nose is so small in that photo, lool.

regarding this Messi-Ronaldo discussion.

Messi's biggest advantage beside his team work is:

Messi plays at his highest level during big matches, he players very well against top rivals like Real, Valencia, Sevilla and even european rivals. while Ronaldo's performance against big 4 was always average especially last year. Messi was impressing against Chelsea in his debut year.

A big player should prove himself against big teams.
 

Mandieta6

www.jewsforjesus.org
Staff member
Moderator
Ronaldo has proven himself against big teams, if ManU did anything in last year's final it was thanks to him. He also destroyed Arsenal in the semis, got them through Porto, and scored in the CL final they did win.

Anyone judging him based on his few Madrid performances doesn't know what they're on about. He's been injured, he's playing in a new team with all the pressure in the world on him, he is still a top performer, and has only faced one big team, Barcelona, at Camp Nou, on his return match. Give em a ******* break.
 

Pogba4Now

Team Captain
No denying that Messi was the best last season by far. Wasn't really Ronaldo's season. He didn't show his full potential and was clearly not focussed in playing for United. In that respect Messi was way better last season but I still think Ronaldo is more complete and have more potential IF he cuts off things like his diving, ego character and complaining/flapping arms when things don't go his way. These are the things that bring him down a whole lot and its such a shame.
 

Mandieta6

www.jewsforjesus.org
Staff member
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bybuti;2788345 said:
I bet Mandieta6 works for Marca. Only Marca thinks that Barcelona's style is boring and Ronaldo is better than Messi. According to Marca, 2 years ago, Robinho was better than Messi, last year it was Robben, while this year Ronaldo, even though the whole World were witness of Messi's class. The fact that Messi has won with such a huge difference against Ronaldo shows who is better. I admit Ronaldo is a great player, but he's a step behind Messi. Winning 2 big trophies such as Ballon d'Or and FIFA's Best Player means that you are the guy who rules football World. And if Messi won against last year's winner with such a big difference, it means that Messi has been better than Ronaldo in the last year (i.e. he has become (and now IS) a better player). It's very simple. It wasn't Barça fans who voted Messi. It were journalists, football players and national team coaches around the World who did.
Clearly not only Marca, a lot of people think Ronaldo is better than Messi. And although fewer, there are plenty of people who find Barca's style boring. But it's good to know that having an unpopular opinion means I'm wrong, you should write a childern's book.

Also, just like a lot of people think Barca's style is fantastic a lot of people think Messi is the ****. Popular opinion = not fact. There are a lot of arguments against Messi's winning those titles. Barca's season meant that one of their players had to win the individual awards, and it could either be Messi or Iniesta/Xavi, in that way they got in each other's way, and these awards always go to the guy with the best tricks. Ronaldo, Kaka, Ronaldinho, all fantastic players, all of them dribblers.

Messi had a better season that Ronaldo, but that doesn't mean he's better. It's logical, but not necessarily so.
 

ArgVega

Yellow Card - Racism; Exp. 31/08/2013
Mandieta6;2788376 said:
Clearly not only Marca, a lot of people think Ronaldo is better than Messi. And although fewer, there are plenty of people who find Barca's style boring. But it's good to know that having an unpopular opinion means I'm wrong, you should write a childern's book.

Also, just like a lot of people think Barca's style is fantastic a lot of people think Messi is the ****. Popular opinion = not fact. There are a lot of arguments against Messi's winning those titles. Barca's season meant that one of their players had to win the individual awards, and it could either be Messi or Iniesta/Xavi, in that way they got in each other's way, and these awards always go to the guy with the best tricks. Ronaldo, Kaka, Ronaldinho, all fantastic players, all of them dribblers.

Messi had a better season that Ronaldo, but that doesn't mean he's better. It's logical, but not necessarily so.
1) For starters youre right popular opinion = not right, just like unpopular opinion = not right too, so thats a double edged sword...

2) How the hell does being a better dribbler make you the better player? its fifa world player of the year, not fifa best trick/dribbler/showboater of the year...

3) Ronaldinho and Ronaldo fantastic dribblers, but kaka is totally different he doesn't use many tricks when taking the opposition on, and didn't cannavaro win a few years back, was he a fantastic dribbler too?

4) I think this award goes to the player who led their team to the most glory, the player who was more decisive and biggest factor for the team, weather by defending, great passing, great goal scoring, or great at taking opposition on with great "dribbling"...

5) Using tricks to get past the opposition is the same as Keeping ball glued to your feet to get past the opposition, they both achieve same result
 

kp41

Fan Favourite
ArgVega;2788395 said:
1) For starters youre right popular opinion = not right, just like unpopular opinion = not right too, so thats a double edged sword...

2) How the hell does being a better dribbler make you the better player? its fifa world player of the year, not fifa best trick/dribbler/showboater of the year...

3) Ronaldinho and Ronaldo fantastic dribblers, but kaka is totally different he doesn't use many tricks when taking the opposition on, and didn't cannavaro win a few years back, was he a fantastic dribbler too?

4) I think this award goes to the player who led their team to the most glory, the player who was more decisive and biggest factor for the team, weather by defending, great passing, great goal scoring, or great at taking opposition on with great "dribbling"...

5) Using tricks to get past the opposition is the same as Keeping ball glued to your feet to get past the opposition, they both achieve same result
strong argument, that's it, just review Fifa World awards.
 

Dytza

Banned - Playing with Fire
Mandieta6;2788336 said:
Anyone judging him based on his few Madrid performances doesn't know what they're on about. He's been injured, he's playing in a new team with all the pressure in the world on him, he is still a top performer, and has only faced one big team, Barcelona, at Camp Nou, on his return match. Give em a ******* break.
I'm not judging him on his Madrid performance! They didn't face many big games like we did this season. Like you said Ronaldo played only against Barça, he was injured against Milan, Sevilla and suspended against Valencia. But I'm judging Ronaldo being decisive for the Big4 clashes I've seen in the last year, for the previous 3 matches against Barcelona (the ones I know the best). How many Liverpool derbies were decided by Ronaldo? What has Ronaldo done in the 3 Barcelona matches? I agree he scored in the UCL final and that's a strong argument. But let's not forget what he did in the most tense moment of that final. He missed a penalty! Sameas in the semifinal against us. Those could have been the two biggest penalties of his career. And he missed them...

Mandieta6;2788376 said:
Clearly not only Marca, a lot of people think Ronaldo is better than Messi. And although fewer, there are plenty of people who find Barca's style boring. But it's good to know that having an unpopular opinion means I'm wrong, you should write a childern's book.

Also, just like a lot of people think Barca's style is fantastic a lot of people think Messi is the ****. Popular opinion = not fact. There are a lot of arguments against Messi's winning those titles. Barca's season meant that one of their players had to win the individual awards, and it could either be Messi or Iniesta/Xavi, in that way they got in each other's way, and these awards always go to the guy with the best tricks. Ronaldo, Kaka, Ronaldinho, all fantastic players, all of them dribblers.

Messi had a better season that Ronaldo, but that doesn't mean he's better. It's logical, but not necessarily so.
I won't argue about the 'boring play' :clapwap:

You said that Messi won those individual trophies because of Barça's season. I think this Barça season was so impressing because of Messi's performance too. He was the most decisive, and the best player of the squad last year.

Nady;2788177 said:
As Arnau said, Ronaldo is NOT better than Messi at headers.He is just taller. Messi has a fantastic header but the height just doesn't help him enough.

Merry Christmas everyone! :biggrinx::biggrinx:
 

kp41

Fan Favourite
Dytza;2788587 said:
But I'm judging Ronaldo being decisive for the Big4 clashes I've seen in the last year, for the previous 3 matches against Barcelona (the ones I know the best). How many Liverpool derbies were decided by Ronaldo? What has Ronaldo done in the 3 Barcelona matches? I agree he scored in the UCL final and that's a strong argument. But let's not forget what he did in the most tense moment of that final. He missed a penalty! Sameas in the semifinal against us. Those could have been the two biggest penalties of his career. And he missed them...



As Arnau said, Ronaldo is NOT better than Messi at headers.He is just taller. Messi has a fantastic header but the height just doesn't help him enough.

It's not "one of the most important".It's the most important aspects in football. I'd put team-work in front of anything from football because as I said, football is a team-game!
I agree Dytza. Ronaldo won the awards last year because he achieved more things than Messi that season and this year was quite opposite so what's the problem?

Messi was much more consistent and effective last year and that's it.

When Messi can score with almost every parts of his body, who cares about heads. (Y) :biggrinx:
 

kp41

Fan Favourite
Even Raul admitted last year that he enjoys watching Guardiola's Barca.

Sir Alex said the same thing multiple times and he said "it's great that his team can play Barca in the final and that's good for football".
 

Arnau

NGR LVR
bybuti;2788625 said:
Yeah, it's your opinion; it's your right to thing so. But finding Barça's style boring, means you like this style:



This is the opposite of Barça's style which apparently you find attractive. That's what I find extremely boring btw.

And those 'a lot people that find Barça's style boring' are a very very small percentage. I haven't read a single article about Barça's boring style till now, while I have read a lot saying that the game Barça does is just hilarious; I haven't heard a single fan (Madrid fan, Man Utd fan, Arsenal fan, ...) saying that Barça's style is boring (besides you), while I have heard a lot of fans, a lot of football players, a lot of football analysts, and others saying that Barça is playing amazing football. So turning that into percentage it's like less than 1%.


Regarding Messi vs Ronaldo. Messi has had a better season which means that he has been and currently is better than Ronaldo. Ronaldinho was the best player 3-4 years ago, but isn't anymore. Ronaldo was 2 years ago (and actually that was thanks to Messi's injuries), but isn't anymore.


Still, both of these issues are a matter of your taste.
thats stupid, juande's madrid its another team than the actual one and even than the 2-6 one.
 

Mandieta6

www.jewsforjesus.org
Staff member
Moderator
ArgVega;2788395 said:
1) For starters youre right popular opinion = not right, just like unpopular opinion = not right too, so thats a double edged sword...

2) How the hell does being a better dribbler make you the better player? its fifa world player of the year, not fifa best trick/dribbler/showboater of the year...

3) Ronaldinho and Ronaldo fantastic dribblers, but kaka is totally different he doesn't use many tricks when taking the opposition on, and didn't cannavaro win a few years back, was he a fantastic dribbler too?

4) I think this award goes to the player who led their team to the most glory, the player who was more decisive and biggest factor for the team, weather by defending, great passing, great goal scoring, or great at taking opposition on with great "dribbling"...

5) Using tricks to get past the opposition is the same as Keeping ball glued to your feet to get past the opposition, they both achieve same result
1. True, I would never suggest otherwise.
2. That's my point, dribbling is overhyped.
3. Cannavaro was the captain of a World Cup winning team. A team with no dribblers to give the award to. Italy won because of their defense, so Cannavaro was the only real choice. Kaka isn't famous for his dribbling, but he was the flair in that Milan team.
4. These awards go to a team, and a player is chosen from that team. I think either Xavi or Iniesta should've won, they're the drive behind Barca's success, but we've argued about this before, and my point is that Messi is given so much praise because of people over-valuing dribbling and flair.
5. Yes.

bybuti;2788625 said:
Yeah, it's your opinion; it's your right to thing so. But finding Barça's style boring, means you like this style:



This is the opposite of Barça's style which apparently you find attractive. That's what I find extremely boring btw.

And those 'a lot people that find Barça's style boring' are a very very small percentage. I haven't read a single article about Barça's boring style till now, while I have read a lot saying that the game Barça does is just hilarious; I haven't heard a single fan (Madrid fan, Man Utd fan, Arsenal fan, ...) saying that Barça's style is boring (besides you), while I have heard a lot of fans, a lot of football players, a lot of football analysts, and others saying that Barça is playing amazing football. So turning that into percentage it's like less than 1%.


Regarding Messi vs Ronaldo. Messi has had a better season which means that he has been and currently is better than Ronaldo. Ronaldinho was the best player 3-4 years ago, but isn't anymore. Ronaldo was 2 years ago (and actually that was thanks to Messi's injuries), but isn't anymore.


Still, both of these issues are a matter of your taste.
That's absolutely retarded. So it's either possession football or catenaccio? Do you know anything about footie? Get your head out of your ass. I find direct, back-and-forth, counter-attaccking footie to be the most entertaining. Why? Because it's non-stop action. Slow-build-up is boring to me.

I'm glad that you're sticking with popular = good.

Form is temporary, class is permanent. You're just unbelievable. Ronaldo was best because Messi as injured, please. And Messi is best now because Ronaldo was busy thinking about Madrid. Give me a break. Before anyone gets their panties in a bunch, I'm not denying that Messi is among the best players in the world, but I think Ronaldo is better.
 

yoyo913

Team Captain
I don't really see a point of stating my opinion but I too think Ronaldo is better. The only reason I say this is becaus I like his style of play more. Messi is the quicker/team-working/all-around great player but I enjoy seeing Ronaldo do what he does for his size and his very unique flair. I think he's the more creative player. I think he's the more revolutionary player. Just my opinion of course (which dosen't really matter).
 

Pogba4Now

Team Captain
Dytza;2788587 said:
As Arnau said, Ronaldo is NOT better than Messi at headers.He is just taller. Messi has a fantastic header but the height just doesn't help him enough.
Lol thats a good point. But unfortunately you gotta be tall to head the ball, thats one thing Ronaldo has over Messi: height.
 

Pogba4Now

Team Captain
bybuti;2788823 said:
Form is temporary, class is permanent. I agree, but does that mean that Ronaldo has been out of form for more than a year now?
He's getting his form back as he showed in the 12 games he played this season scoring 13 goals.
 
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