Help Adding Phase In National Cup

[Brouette]

Hello hello,

I created new leagues that i would like to include in the france national cup but i don't really understand how to do it.

The vanilla cup is played by the teams of ligue 1 and ligue 2.
I would like to add 64 cfa (4th divisions) teams i made and 18 other teams of 3rd division. But the scema is a bit hard to understand

Could someone help me with it ? (just explaination)

Thanks by advance

 

[mrliioadin]

Hey there,

So this is the wonderful world of tournament planning. It's especially difficult when we aren't mirror reality exactly. In the case of the French Cup, there are actually many many more teams entering from many other leagues. So, we're just going to have to make a believable system.

I don't have time to explain it all now, but I hope I can give you a rough tournament structure that will work. You can try to start designing it in CM15 from there. If you figure it out, great! If not, I'll be around later and can provide some help.

These cup competitions have teams from higher leagues entering at more and more advanced stages usually. So we have to progressively add new teams and eliminate old ones. I think you'd want to add the ligue 1 teams at the round of 32 (even though it's actually the round of 64 in reality). That has to do with the number of total teams we have to play with (122).

So everything from the round of 32 on would be a standard knockout tournament without any byes.

Our problem is dealing with the mass of teams before that point. I came up with this solution:

Round of 32

32 total teams
20 byes (ligue 1 teams)
12 teams need to qualify

Round 6

24 teams
no byes
all must qualify
12 teams advance

Round 5

48 teams
38 byes (Ligue 2 and Ligue 3 teams)
10 must qualify
24 teams advance

Round 4

20 teams
no byes
all must qualify
10 teams advance

Round 3

40 teams
20 byes (top 5 teams from each of 4 divisions in ligue 4)
20 must qualify
20 teams advance

Round 2

40 teams
36 byes (teams ranked 6 to 14 from each of the 4 divisions in ligue 4)
4 teams must qualify
20 teams advance

Round 1

8 teams
all remaining teams enter here
4 teams advance

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That math should add up. Then it's just a matter of implementing it in CM15. I'll help with that, I'm just outta time right now.

 

[Brouette]

Big thanks for your answmer!

I think i understand, i finish some details with the teams and ill try that when i'll have time for , thanks

If you have more advices don't hesitate to write them.
Thanks

 

[Brouette]

Questions: how i set teams following their positionning in their ligue like " 36 byes (teams ranked 6 to 14 from each of the 4 divisions in ligue 4)" ?

 

[mrliioadin]

That's where the "pots" come in. In the very first setup stage, you will need to create 1 group for each "pool" of teams that will be receiving a bye.

That means:

G1 - All Ligue 1 teams (total 20 teams)
G2 - All Ligue 2 teams and top 4 Ligue 3 teams. (total 24 teams)
G3 - Rest of the Ligue 3 teams (total 14 teams?)
G4 - Top 5 teams from each Ligue 4 Div (total 20 teams)
G5 - Next 5 teams from each Ligue 4 Div. (total 20 teams)
G6 - Next 4 teams from each Ligue 4 Div. (total 16 teams)
G7 - Next 1 team from each Ligue 4 Div. (total 4 teams)
G8 - Next 1 team from each Ligue 4 Div. (total 4 teams)

I've noticed that FIFA15 can get weird when there are a lot of groups in the setup stage. So if this doesn't work it might need to be condensed down a bit. I hate doing that but sometimes have to. If that happens,
Combine G2&3
Combine 5&6
Combine 7&8

 

[Brouette]

Thanks for your help!
I'll try that when ill have time, surely end of week.

But im thinking, my 4th division will work with pools then, but the only mean i find for make it work with pools its to create a big league with 64 teams; then make G1 => take teams from "4th division" => max number team = 20

So my question is, how i do then when i'll set the cup, for set for example that :"top 5 teams from each of 4 divisions in ligue 4" ? the computer will detect it himself ?

 

[mrliioadin]

Thanks for your help!
I'll try that when ill have time, surely end of week.

But im thinking, my 4th division will work with pools then, but the only mean i find for make it work with pools its to create a big league with 64 teams; then make G1 => take teams from "4th division" => max number team = 20

So my question is, how i do then when i'll set the cup, for set for example that :"top 5 teams from each of 4 divisions in ligue 4" ? the computer will detect it himself ?

I'm not sure I understood that. I assumed you had the 4th division in 4 different leagues. Even if you don't, that still won't preclude you from pulling specific places of teams. Instead of telling it to grab all the teams, just tell it to grab 5 teams (for example) and then specify one by one which positions those should come from.

We talked a lot about this in this thread: http://www.soccergaming.com/forums/showthread.php?t=192326

and I posted a pictorial tutorial walking people through building a tournament. Take a look through that tutorial and look at how I grabbed teams from the pools. You will do something similar in the setup stage from your respective leagues.

If I'm missing your question or that isn't a sufficient answer, post again and clarify.

 

[Brouette]

Thank you

I made a mistake, in max number team i put 16 and not 20..

But im interrested in the fact to create the 4th divisions with 4 different lieagues, i like that but the promotion and relegation with 3th divions worked just with the first 4th division league. If you have other way for that i take it

Im gonna watch the thread, thanks

 

[mrliioadin]

You are saying that you had them all in one league and had promotion/relegation problems?

Or, are you saying you had them in separate leagues and had promotion/relegation problems?

Whichever is the case, try the other.

 

[Brouette]

Yep, i had them in seperate league so i had problem with promotion and relegation, so now they are in one league and its good.

 

[mrliioadin]

Yep, i had them in seperate league so i had problem with promotion and relegation, so now they are in one league and its good.

That makes sense. So now When you build the cup, just grab them from the groups in the league rather than separate leagues.

 

[Brouette]

I started to make the cup then, but i got some misunderstanding.

I watched your other topics but it don't help much, i would want know how, when you create the group in setup stage, how you make them following their ranking in their own competitions. I know how set "the best N team of a trophy" but i dont know like how choose the 4 last of a league and stuff like that.

Is that in the setup stage or it something to do in round stage with "sort by competition average" and the standing rank stuff ?
Or i must set "team n°16 from 4th division G1" etc in first tour stage in advance rule ?


Thanks by advance for your help

 

[mrliioadin]

Bah you're right that is harder than I was expecting. I'm not sure I exactly have a solution for you. But a couple of things to try.

Option 1. There is the option to get specific teams from a league in order. If you do two back to back setup stages, the first one can be where make four groups (one for each division 4 team) then get specific teams from league in order. The second setup stage, you will pull each team one-by-one from setup stage 1 group x into setup stage 2 where you're grabbing teams from position y. Tell me if that doesn't make sense and I'll diagram it out. I've had difficulty getting the two setup-stages back to back to work. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong with it yet, but I've found that strategy tough to use. Maybe you can try though?

Option 2. redesign the tournament (I had a hard time designing that one, so I might start with the first option).

 

[Brouette]

Thanks,

I think i understood many more stuff in the trophy's editing by making my pool leagues.
I already modified the league i made, i was using bad schema for it, i swapped some stuff, im gonna try the national cup editing by many way and watch wich one will work, i think im on the good way, ill tell you progress when iwill get it work

(BTW, another subject, do you know why in my career mod, since i modified the game i always get "cm_managerobjectives_mail_-1" things like that, instead of get the club objective ?)
Anyway its interresting what we can do with modding !

 

[mrliioadin]

You can try regenerating your Bh files to get rid of the objectives issue. I'm not sure if it works for that or not. It's looking for a string referring to an objective. But, it doesn't have a record of what that string should say. Regen might fix.

 

[Brouette]

Ill do that. I need to fix some stuff before, i got crash when i launch a season match in the career mod with my 4th division sometimes, and sometimes no, im searching why

 

[Brouette]

I finally get all my leagues working fines. I started to config the cup then, but i got crash when start the career i don't know why, i strictly respected the schema and took other cup in example.. Maybe there is so much team for the cup ? or i should make less group ?

I think there is a solution (if its due to number of teams, but i dont know, cause the fa cup got much team too..) its to make the first tours of the cup (with ligue 4 & 5) in another trophy, and to make the 10 qualified play in the normal national cup. But what schema i must use for that , playoff , cup ?

thanks for answer

 

[mrliioadin]

I finally get all my leagues working fines. I started to config the cup then, but i got crash when start the career i don't know why, i strictly respected the schema and took other cup in example.. Maybe there is so much team for the cup ? or i should make less group ?

I think there is a solution (if its due to number of teams, but i dont know, cause the fa cup got much team too..) its to make the first tours of the cup (with ligue 4 & 5) in another trophy, and to make the 10 qualified play in the normal national cup. But what schema i must use for that , playoff , cup ?

thanks for answer

This is where it gets tough. I usually try to strip everything but the very first stage out and try to get just one stage working. After that I add another setup stage group. Test it. If that works, add the next cup stage, test it... And so on. It should help you figure out where it is falling apart.

 

[klear]

Also skimming over this thread out of interest. It's a good read.

Nice to see someone with a grasp of tournament mode. It's a great feature but very complex when you're dealing with teams entering at different stages etc..

I haven't really had a big crack at it just yet but I'm hoping to include a big domestic cup competition when I've finished adding leagues. Your input is invaluable.

Many thanks.

 

[Brouette]

@mrliioadin: Are you sure there is no a team limit of 64 ? If no im gonna try what you say
EDIT: the problem must be somewhere else.. even with fewer teams i got crash.. But how can i test phase one per one ? the game wont crash if the cup isnt fully programmed (first tour, second, etc...) ?
Mostly, the cup work in direct tournement mode with all teams (122)... But when i launch career, crash.

@klear: Nice to see that this topic is useful for someone else, its good, i always search help in serious editing on this forum but hard to find a clear topic