Star wars final battle a.k.a "El clásico" [P+R]

[adedawson]

NO MATE.

You are missing the point. I admit Ronney has a huge influence on the team, but he wasn't ready to play. He played injured and after only two knocks he took on his leg, he got injured again.

An injured player always risks for worse injury. AND SAF KNOWS THAT.

your still missing the point that he played his best player and won with no major loss too player of doing so.

 

[Pogba4Now]

Well, Puyol is better than Maxwell even as a LB, but the problem is that we need him in the center more.



Exactly. Pep is smarter than SAF and Venger. He won't make the same mistake with Ibra. He did that with Iniesta and Henry, but that was a different story. It was the biggest final of the year and the last match of the year.

But, on the other side, I have a feeling that Ibra will be in the bench. I don't know why but this news of letting Ibra out of the list that easily makes me believe so. And also, Sport was reporting today that Ibra was given the green light to play. Anyhow, I wouldn't risk him and even though Ibra would travel in Madrid, that would only be to put more fear on Madrid.


Personaly, I do believe that we'll leave the Bernabeu with our heads up. That means that tomorrow midnight we'll be the team leading the table.

For f*ck's sake, Wenger or SAF weren't gifted with players like Messi, Bojan, Iniesta, Xavi etc to start with. Don't ever compare Guarduola ever until he brings a mid-table team with average players to the top. Guardiola's achievement was amazing last season considering its his first season as manager. But put him in charge of a mid-table team. Chances are that he would struggle.

Yeah, with the Ibra thing, he showed that he's smarter than SAF and Wenger. Even though he has only 2-3 years experience as a coach, he didn't make the mistake of pushing an injured player go out and play.

Unfortunately SAF doesn't have as much depth in the squad as Guardiola has. We have only 3 players only who could play as striker and Owen was injured. We were left with only Berbatov who didn't fit into Fergie's tactics for that game. Did you expect him to play 18 year old Macheda to start against Bayern? Fergie had to risk Rooney for that game. Our tactics wouldn't work with Berbatov. He can't play in high tempo games.

And btw, he's beaten both of them, SAF and Wenger. Besides he's smarter than them, he's also better manager than them.

LOL. Come on. As I said before, put him in a mid-table team.

I credit Pep more for having our players in great form, he makes mistakes in his tactics sometimes, but as has been pointed out, here at Barca there is only a Plan A. You can see he is starting to play around with formations as its nice to see, but I think he still has quite some years left before he can match the experience of SAF and Arsene.

You can see Arsene and SAF change tactics and formations from game to game, and that has alot to do with their experience of playing against so many different teams and managing so many in they're managerial careers. I think thats what makes them at this time better than Pep, they can formulate game plans better than Pep from their massive ammounts of experience in competitions.

But Pep has his teams in unreal form, sometimes better than SAF and Arsene do, which is also commendable itself.

Agreed for the most part. Well said. I noticed Guardiola is starting to play a bit with formations and tactics. He has the potential to be a great manager but with less that 2 years in the game, you can't compare him to SAF or Wenger yet. If Wenger or SAF had all these players at their disposition, I'm sure they would've achieved a lot as well. Shame that England doesn't have talent. Barca are lucky that they have so many talents coming from the academy.

 

[Pogba4Now]

What is the point you are referring to then?


MY POINT IS: You should not play an injured player.

And Sir Alex Ferguson MISSED THAT.


And he LOST. He lost the match and he lost Rooney for some other weeks.

That loss had nothing to do with Rooney on. In fact, we played our best football scoring 3-0 with Rooney on. Bayern were too busy marking Rooney that they freed up Nani and Valencia. It paid off. We scored 3 goals while he was there. His tactics worked until the red card and Rooney subbed due to injury.

And Btw, Rooney is not out for long. probably 1 week. His injury was not serious as anticipated before the Bayern game.

 

[adedawson]

lmao the point I was trying to make and AZ made was that he played his best and most influential player and got the result he needed from him. Its almost won him the game.

And again as AZ pointed out he only misses one game vs Blackburn and is back for the big Man City game. We needed him for Bayern and City and we got him for both.

And then the underlying point that the physios gave him the all clear, there was no supposed risk. Rooney himself also gave the All clear. Then there's the days of training before hand where he was running rampant. But non of that matters. Saf made a tactical choice and it worked, we had him for Bayern and we have him for City.

*edit* Nady Explained it a lot better then me forgive my writing skills. I got a C in English. You probably speak better English then me lol

& lol a page and a half talking about SAF in a classico thread. I don't see anyone talking about pep in derby matches. I'm only messing.

*edit 2*

ArgVega speaks the truth... I missed that somehow. +1 for him.

 

[Help?]

Man, just live bybuti alone, he is too immature to realize that he is talking non-sense. You are all just wasting your time.

 

[Xifio]

He overpaid for Ibra and Chygry, neither of which turned out to be as good as expected of them.

not arguing with the rest of it ... not arguing with overpaying for the Ukranian ... but Zlatan is always worth the money ... Barça were only ever willing to part with €45m ... Zlatan was Italy's Golden Boot, and Inter's MVP by far ... so they weren't going to part with him without having lined up an apt replacement, and of course compensation for selling their best player ... Eto'o was thrown into the deal at a valuation of €20m because he was never going to sign a new deal with Barça, and was thus going to walk away on a Bosman in a year ... if he was going to walk away for free, then Barça might as well throw him into a deal they wanted to close, especially if it would close the deal -- which is exactly what they did ...

Zlatan has done very well, IMO ... he holds the all-time club record by scoring in the first 5 matches of the season ... he's provided a number of classy assists ... he's scored in all the big matches and in the derbies (defying all the bulsh!t that he disappears in the big matches) ... and he's scored all the away goals for the team in the knockout rounds of the Champion League so far (defying all the bullsh!t about him not having scored in the knockouts before or against English opposition before) ... even though he went through a barren spell starting at the beginning of this year, he has bounced back, and scored 5 in the last 4 he has played ...

you have to remember, he is playing in a new league with a new team ... when Eto'o was signed by Barcelona, he was straight into the European Golden Shoe race ... but that is because he had been playing in Spain since he was 17 ...

and on that note: what is Eto'o doing in his first season in Italy? as much as I love the guy, he has not really impressed at Inter ... and at one point not too long ago, he was dropped from the team ... he's been doing better since then, but he certainly hasn't had as much of an impact as Zlatan has had at Barcelona ...

in the second leg against Arsenal, Barcelona really didn't create too much in terms of chances ... despite it not really being apparent, they have gotten used to having Zlatan as that big focus up top, especially against the top-level opposition (and not the smaller local teams) ... all of Messi's goals had an element of either individuality or defensive error in them, instead of the classic Barcelona goals where the defence is carved open, and the ball is passed around the opposition defence and into the goal ...

 

[Zakov]

It's not alright to compare a coach with only 2 years experience with others with 30 years of experience.

And btw, he's beaten both of them, SAF and Wenger. Besides he's smarter than them, he's also better manager than them.

Oh, he hasn't beaten them, but he has [Mandieta6] trashed [/Mandieta6] both of them.

Sorry to intervene buti(But this is a forum after all), but this whole argument started because you were comparing them(Pep n Fergie) in the first place.

Unless I interpreted it wrongly.

 

[mogolos]

lol there r a lot of guys here who provide their innormal egoism and their personal arguments over the most important event of the weekend...their sick shadow covers the event and forces us be lost in stupid estimations. It is simply the best fight between the 2 football giants, just relax and enjoy...

 

[Arnau]

go hell everyone of you, screw the alcoholic fergie, the pedophile wenger, and the faggot guardiola. Madrid VS Barça, nothing else cares.

 

[newbie original]

I can only watch the first 45 minutes so hopefully it's a 5-5 draw with all 10 goals coming in the first half.

I hate Real much more than Barca....

I agree with this man.

 

[Vedran-10]

Pep is the perfect manager for Barcelona right now. He won the Treble in his debut season. Now, it's true we've had an amazing squad since 2004, but you still have to be a proper manager to pull off a Treble. In your first try. Playing probably the best footy the world has ever seen along the way.

Pep may not be the world's best manager (lets wait and talk in about a decade), but he suits Barcelona and he is extremely successful. Having in mind everything the guy's achieved (and stands to achieve), to still try and argue that he somehow lacks managerial ability... it defies reason.

 

[mnj2x]

Cant wait. Rooting for madrid. (underdogs)

 

[Dytza]

WTF?! Iniesta benched. Dani Alves or Maxwell in the midfield?? So this is our line-up:

Víctor Valdés, Puyol, Milito, Piqué, Maxwell, Sergio Busquets, Xavi, Alves, Keita, Pedro y Messi.

 

[Xifio]

WTF?! Iniesta benched. Dani Alves or Maxwell in the midfield?? So this is our line-up:

Víctor Valdés, Puyol, Milito, Piqué, Maxwell, Sergio Busquets, Xavi, Alves, Keita, Pedro y Messi.

it'll be Maxwell at LW (with Pedro on the other side), and Puyol playing LB ... I expect ...

 

[KingPaulV]

Puyol RB Maxwell LB Dani ALves RW

 

[ARIAGA II]

it'll be Maxwell at LW (with Pedro on the other side), and Puyol playing LB ... I expect ...

No it's Alves at RW (interesting)

Barcelona: Valdés; Maxwell, Milito, Piqué, Puyol; Busquets, Keita, Xavi; Pedro, Playstation, Alves

and Lo Puto Crack on the bench.

Real Madrid: Casillas, Ramos, Arbeloa, Albiol, Garay; Gago, Xabi Alonso, Marcelo, Van der Vaart; Pipita, CR9

 

[Pogba4Now]

He was in charge of Barça B when they were way down on the table (near relegation zone). At the end of the season, Barça B celebrated the championship.

Barca B had a lot of talented players TBH... Still a great achievement though. I'd love to see him do that with a La Liga team though.

Man, I said it and I'll say it again.

It's not alright to compare a coach with only 2 years experience with others with 30 years of experience.

Agreed.

But, also, it's not alright, actually it's madness, to say that Pep Guardiola was just a toy in Barça's dressing room.

But, if you come to a point when you don't rate him at all. Then look what he has achieved.

I only compare Pep with others when others thing that Pep had done nothing so far.

I never said that he's a "toy" or something. I was actually impressed by his first season. But as I said before, I'd love to see him face tough challenges. So far he hasn't had to deal with any.

My point about the smarter one was only about 'the injured players'. That's it.

Pep made a smarter decision than SAF and Wenger.

As has been said before, United are toothless without Rooney. Have you seen the United Chelsea game? I think this guy would explain it better than me, so I'll just quote him:

Tell me this then. How much of a choice did Ferguson have compared to Pep? Does United have another Messi that can score goals like that? After being proven by Chelsea that we are toothless in attack without Rooney, it was either risk him and know with certainty that you can score any moment or not risk Rooney and not know whether you'll be able to even have a single decent shot in the whole game? The reasoning is just stupid man, United squad is not Barcelona squad.

Play Berbatov. Play Macheda.

Simply put, Berbatov is a United flop. He's a great player but doesn't fit United's game. Macheda? He's 18 something with NO experience in the UCL... And he's been back from injury as well. I'm sure he would do a better job than Berbatov, but he's still a naive and inexperienced player. He needs 2-3 more years before he can play in the first team.

Play a B-team guy.

Pep, this inexperienced coach, has done it. And it worked.

Unfortunately Fergie doesn't have young talents in reserves team who could be up to this game. As I said before, United is not Barca. We are not gifted with talented players from our reserves team. Talents have been scarce throughout england since years... What we've got from the academy for the past 10 years is O'Shea and Fletcher. England doesn't produce as much talent as Spain. the reason why teams like Arsenal have exclusively foreign players.

You can't risk someones career for only a match.

risk his career? Are you serious? It was definitely not a risk to his carreer lol. To start with, it was just a mere "ankle sprain". Not a fracture or tendonitis or anything like that. It wasn't s serious injury. Besides, the physios said he could play and Rooney himself was ready for it... Its definitely not "risking his carreer" lol.

We come again at a point on which we don't agree.

Barça has the talent? So what? Rijkaard also had the talent, but he failed for 2 years in a row. Rijkaard is my idol btw.

Yeah but at the time Guardiola came, these same players were emerging as the best players in the world... During Rijkaard's time, they were still developing. + during his time, many players were unsettled etc. Guardiola trimmed the squad and added some new faces. Credits to him for doing that, but the facts remain that he had a team full of talents to start with.

"That loss had nothing to do with Rooney on."
"In fact, we played our best football scoring 3-0 with Rooney on."

This two don't go together. Anyhow, I don't doubt SAF's tactical abilities. You could have still play that 'best football' even without Rooney.

Have you seen the United Chelsea game? With Carrick, Fletcher, Scholes etc, where did you expect the goals to come from? Out of nowhere? I don't think we'd be able to play like that with Berbatov instead of Rooney. The reason why Rooney was brought in was tactical. He didn't do much, but the focus was on him everytime leaving others free. Berbatov would've slowed our game as he always does. And if you noticed, we played a very high tempo game in the first half. Berbatov is not suitable for that.

For instance, we had a game 'to be or not to be' against Inter in the group stage. Neither Ibra nor Messi were 100% fit, so they were sit on bench. And we did play one of the best games of the season that night.

Barcelona has enough players to make up for the absence of Zlatan or Messi... Whereas United don't... Its sad but its the truth. Barca is a lot better team in terms of quality and depth. United's squad is not Barca's squad.

Pep is the perfect manager for Barcelona right now. He won the Treble in his debut season. Now, it's true we've had an amazing squad since 2004, but you still have to be a proper manager to pull off a Treble. In your first try. Playing probably the best footy the world has ever seen along the way.

Pep may not be the world's best manager (lets wait and talk in about a decade), but he suits Barcelona and he is extremely successful. Having in mind everything the guy's achieved (and stands to achieve), to still try and argue that he somehow lacks managerial ability... it defies reason.

Very well put. Agreed. He definitely has the potential to become one of the most decorated manager. In fact he has won it all already in 1 season. But I'd like to see him face more challenges... So far he hasn't had to deal with a lot of difficulties... For e.g he hasn't had to deal with Messi, Iniesta, Xavi, Zlatan, Alves being out injured or something like that.

go hell everyone of you, screw the alcoholic fergie, the pedophile wenger, and the faggot guardiola. Madrid VS Barça, nothing else cares.

Best post of this thread




================================

Anyways on topic, I'm gonna look for a stream right now Can't wait.

 

[Xifio]

it'll be Maxwell at LW (with Pedro on the other side), and Puyol playing LB ... I expect ...

No it's Alves at RW (interesting)

yup .. so that effectively ensures that no one is playing "out of position" -- Dani Alves has been playing at that RM/RW position for Brazil (because Maicon is the 1st choice for R ... EDIT: I'd rather have Puyol and Dani Alves up against Cristiano cantering forward up the flanks, than have Maxwell try to stop the Portugeezer ...


EDIT 2:

not the best match in terms of a spectacle so far ... but the man in form does the business again, following a brilliant clipped return pass from Xavi ...

 

[kp41]

I expected much better performance from both teams, lots of errors and I think the goal was the only good opportunity. But we all know the tension of this match, so it's understandable. Though, I'm pretty impressed by the pace.

I think that foul on Messi was penalty. Real player hit his ankle at the end. Messi's intelligence and Xavi's fantastic fantastic pass made the first goal. Pique and Puyol are doing a good job as well. I feel Real players are so angry and want to kick Barca players in any chance.

Btw, Is that Owen Hargreaves playing for Real?

 

[Xifio]

it'll be Maxwell at LW (with Pedro on the other side), and Puyol playing LB ... I expect ...

No it's Alves at RW (interesting)

yup .. so that effectively ensures that no one is playing "out of position" -- Dani Alves has been playing at that RM/RW position for Brazil (because Maicon is the 1st choice for R ... EDIT: I'd rather have Puyol and Dani Alves up against Cristiano cantering forward up the flanks, than have Maxwell try to stop the Portugeezer ...

haha, Pep tried his combination in the first half, and now at the start of the second half, he's gone with the setup I expected/preferred