Brain Aneurysm!!!!

[Nuno]

I play 10 minute games. 2-3 goal average per game. The results vary on my concentration. Sometimes I can't score. Other times I can't stop scoring. It really depends on whether I'm facing Barca or Malaga.

Man, I wish I had saved the goals from the Cup final with Barca. I was down 0-1 in the first half and tied it up in the 2nd. I won 2-1 in overtime with a sweet goal from newly acquired Van Der Vaart.

 

[JohnPublic40k]

Aqua, you've taken the words out of my mouth. I couldn't agree with you more.

That said, I think too many people have reported experiencing this "cpu boost" for it to be imagined. If you are a PES god and therefore able to hold the cpu opponent off and win, then more power to you, but frankly I don't care what you have to say when you start your post off by taking cheap and immature shots at people. What I do care about is bringing up matters like this one and discussing them so that the NEXT pes/we is even more realistic. Every version of PES has been better than the previous. PES4 excells in so many areas that PES3 did not, but that does not mean it cannot be improved upon. It is important that gameplay issues such as this one, are brought up and discussed so that our friends at Konami might take notice and improve upon them in future releases/patches.

Perhaps it is a matter of stamina, but I cannot tell you how many times I have brought in fresh defenders and swapped to a defensive formation only to still have this happen. (And yes, I've also tried to keep my formation, as I have also tried to be more attack minded, it matters not.)

Just because someone raises a question and voices an opinion doesn't mean they do not enjoy playing the game.

I'll ask you the reader to put your pride away for just a minute and be honest. Those of you that report being able to hold off the cpu and complete the win without a problem: what difficulty are you playing on? Even if you do not experience a drop in your own players performance, do you find the cpu stepping up their own efforts? Do you find league play more challenging than "match" play?

EDIT: The two posts above this one came in as I was typing. Perhaps it is a game length sensitive issue. I have been playing 20 min matches in ML.

 

[Nuno]

I'm playing Master's League on 6 stars with a mix of Spanish and Portuguese teams. I play 10 minute games.

I feel the difference between Barca and say Malaga for example. It's easy to break down Malaga, but Barca is a freaking monster to beat.

I don't think the computer cheats, I think they just attack more when they're losing. I actually find it easier to get behind their defense, cause they're pushing up so much.

I'm always monitoring my players condition and I never let them play tired.

 

[JohnPublic40k]

Ok, its not frustrating any more so much as its just comical. I got home not long ago and played a few online matches, then decided to give my ML another shot. I scored in the 22' and then went on full tilt defense for the rest of the match. The cpu managed to score and the game ended in a draw. Nothing new, but I've left out the good part... they scored the tying goal with less than 2 seconds remaining in stoppage time. I swear to you, TWO SECONDS!!! I held them off for 68 minutes and they scored with two seconds left! Good times.

EDIT: Perhaps somewhere deep down in my psyche I'm letting this happen. Some sort of sick, twisted self-fufilling prophesy.

 

[spiteri]

Regardless of whats been said...including the jab at my non posh lingo :P ... if you think the game is ripping you off, stop playing it.

It's a rather simple solution to an otherwise non complex problem.

Was that posh enough???

I enjoy the challenge of not winning every game on 6 star, and some times I feel like throwing my joypad through the monitor, but yea...chin up fella!!!

 

[JohnPublic40k]

Actually, I believe "non complex" is hyphenated.

I never said the game is ripping me off or cheating me in any way. You read that into my posts. I'm only saying that is very challenging and perhaps a little unrealistic. My last post was completely tongue-in-cheek and I'm sorry that you failed to see that.

 

[ge4ce]

Originally posted by JohnPublic40k
I scored in the 22' and then went on full tilt defense for the rest of the match. The cpu managed to score and the game ended in a draw.

You really shouldn't go defensive after just 22 min. of the match and only 1 goal up. Attack is the best defence.
The CPU is very weak in defence after you score 2 or more goals (because they change tactics to attack, check the formation screen at the start of the game and then again few times in a match, you will see that CPU changes tactics and players to catch you) - then it's (in most cases) thrashing time!

 

[ge4ce]

Originally posted by JohnPublic40k
I'll ask you the reader to put your pride away for just a minute and be honest. Those of you that report being able to hold off the cpu and complete the win without a problem: what difficulty are you playing on? Even if you do not experience a drop in your own players performance, do you find the cpu stepping up their own efforts? Do you find league play more challenging than "match" play?

6*, the cpu tries to attack more when i'm 1 goal or more up (check the formation screen while playing). This leaves more holes in his defence which must be punished with attacking play (not the defence!!). Especially usefull are then 1-2 passes and through balls and fast players up front.
BTW, Koller doesn't play in my first eleven for B. Dortmund (he is very, very slow).

 

[Gnidrologist]

Agree with you on that, ge4ce. Attack is the best defence in Pes4, maybe even to somewhat unrealistic extent. In Pes3 you could play equaly well with various formations/tactics, both attacking and defensive as for Pes4, I've learned that crazy all-out-attack formations with few defenders placed in line and pushed to the very edge of defensive area and lots of attacking players, are the most effective way to win matches. I think that CPU gets fewer chances on your goal and doesn't make that many ''crazy throgh balls'' this way.

 

[dizi]

**** Happens

 

[Nuno]

Originally posted by JohnPublic40k
Ok, its not frustrating any more so much as its just comical. I got home not long ago and played a few online matches, then decided to give my ML another shot. I scored in the 22' and then went on full tilt defense for the rest of the match. The cpu managed to score and the game ended in a draw. Nothing new, but I've left out the good part... they scored the tying goal with less than 2 seconds remaining in stoppage time. I swear to you, TWO SECONDS!!! I held them off for 68 minutes and they scored with two seconds left! Good times.

EDIT: Perhaps somewhere deep down in my psyche I'm letting this happen. Some sort of sick, twisted self-fufilling prophesy.

I beat AC Milan 1-0(Off Season friendly) yesterday with Real Madrid's defense. They tried their hardest to score, but they couldn't get past my second string defence of Lahm, Del Horno, Heitinga, and Mejia. Only Del Horno had over 80 in defense stats. The computer doesn't lower you stats, it just attacks more ferociously like any team would in that situation.

 

[plus4s]

Wow pro evo fans actually having a row over pro evo faults, i thought i was in the fifa 2005 forum for a minute.
So do you think there will be a patch to address the so called "cheating" problem , along with the goalkeeper AI problem.
Or do you think konami will do nothing, because they know people will be waiting eagerly for pro evolution 5.
I for one love pro evolution soccer and i have to admit to being a complete novice, and therefore i have to also admit that if the cpu is cheating i am to dumb to recognise it



Pes really does rule the roost

 

[JohnPublic40k]

Well, I don't really think Konami sees it as a problem. I think that the computer really steps up its attack if they are behind and make harder runs for the ball, this, in turn can cause your player to trip and lose control. Its coded into the game on purpose. However, there are two things I think they could do to improve the system overall:

1. Randomize it where sometimes the cpu starts off busting its balls trying to score right off the bat instead of always waiting to fall behind or waiting until the dying moments.

2. Give all players better balance and ball control in general.

NOTICE
Please do not see these statements as complaints. PES4 has substantially better ai than PES3, and superb ai overall for a sports game.

 

[Nuno]

Originally posted by JohnPublic40k
Well, I don't really think Konami sees it as a problem. I think that the computer really steps up its attack if they are behind and make harder runs for the ball, this, in turn can cause your player to trip and lose control. Its coded into the game on purpose. However, there are two things I think they could do to improve the system overall:

1. Randomize it where sometimes the cpu starts off busting its balls trying to score right off the bat instead of always waiting to fall behind or waiting until the dying moments.

2. Give all players better balance and ball control in general.

NOTICE
Please do not see these statements as complaints. PES4 has substantially better ai than PES3, and superb ai overall for a sports game.

Oh, you just like to bitch......jk

 

[pere]

The Computer cheats!

Lets think just a tiny second about this sentence...

noticed something?

YES!
It is indeed the most ridiculous excuse ever for getting smacked in a single player game. It is even better than "My gamepad did not work properly, at least in that one second".

Its a simple fact that cheating actually requires some sort of intention as a prerequisite.

So what you are talking about actually is that your pc got pissed because he was behind and then decided (prerequisite: free will) to enable some cheat and bust your a**.

It makes NO sense.
IMO this gets the unbeatabe top score for silly excuses, really.


If you complain about the difficulty, its a different thing. Yes, at higher levels cpu players may do things you can't. but thats just a way to compensate for your ability to play creatively. So its even odds, at least as nearly as possible. Actually nearer than in every footie game before IMO.

But to say the CPU cheats.. Really guys, common...

 

[aqua]

to be honest pere, you clearly have no idea what we are talking about

 

[JohnPublic40k]

C'mon Aqua, its a three page thread. Clearly our friend here is a very busy man and just didn't have the time to actually read those first two pages, so he did the sensible thing: skimmed over half of page two, read a post or two on three and told us, very matter of factly, the lord's gospel on this discussion.

Case closed.

 

[spiteri]

It was the point I was trying to make.

It's not cheating by the CPU.

The program/code knows to step it up if it's behind.

How many goals have you scored on the counter in the 90th minute cause the CPU was pressing hard after going behind??

I guess we human players could be cheating from a certain point of view, I mean we do know that the CPU is going to push up and all we need to do is keep a man up front and wait for the turnover???

Is that not cheating???

 

[Snowy]

Re: Brain Aneurysm!!!!

Originally posted by JohnPublic40k
Ok, its driving me crazy that if I play a quick stand alone match I can win on 6 stars usually by two or more goals, but If I'm in League mode every match ends in a tie, regardless of the difficulty!!!!!!! I just played 6 ML matches that were all 1-1 or 2-2 ties on four stars. And the most frustating part? In four of those matches I was winning with less than 5 mins (gametime) remaining!!!

Gah!!!

Sorry, just venting.

I am just the complete opposite. I play in the ML on 5 stars and win most of my matches. I can score using different methods.

On the stand alone match...ALL i get is losses or draws when I play against Inter, Chelsea and Arsenal .

Maybe I score once in 2 matches and it;s always through a low cross + header and never on a one on one situation.

It's frustrating and I use the same team on ML and the stand alone match without any transferred uber player.


P.S. WRT those players who say the comp AI gets uber after going down 1-0 there is/ *might be* an explanation for it in the manual. It has something to do with your players stats, the mentality one. Players with high mentality play more aggressively and their stats go up when they're behind.

 

[Snowy]

I tried playing on 5* against an average team like Blackburn Rovers. I finally scored something other than a cross, YAY , and the AI wasn't able to counter. I saw them do funny mistakes like I used to do against teams like Inter and AC Milan and Arsenal, namely stuff like stumbling over balls, missing passes, and once the AI took a kick at my goal and missed the ball completely !!! .

So I guess it migh have something to do with player stats, namely mentality. I remember looking up mentality once in PES3 and it said something like how much harder the player will play if it is behind.

That's why there are some Korean, nigerian players for sale with great stats but are cheap. If you take a closer look you notice they have have poor stats in things like aggressiveness and mentality.