"Champions" League - UEFA finally gets the point

[goal_machine84]

It would be nice to give the small clubs a chance at glory. I just think giving the Cup winner a place in the qualifying rounds should do the trick. A small club making the CL group stage would make a lot of money and chances are it could be stronger next year. That means more competition each season and some different stuff for us to watch. Not to mention there would still be big clubs in the CL and at the end of the day, those clubs would still be reaching the final stages anyway.

The chance at glory is already given by giving them a UEFA cup spot as help? said...i agree that by giving FA cup winners a CL spot, there will be some variety in the matches and lots of "different stuff" and it will help the level of football in those teams...the players of a lower league team can get invaluable experience playing on the biggest european stage and get noticed plus the financial gains to the clubs will give a boost to their future plans

But, i believe that "Champions" League should remain Champions League....in other words the top 4 in the top domestic league have earned their right to be there.....afterall, even Man Utd was once relegated....the fans support, great managers and gradual success eventually landed them a CL spot.....that is wat it takes to be in the CL

I just cant support the idea of FA cup winners being given CL spots....it will be unfair to the top division teams who have battled so hard to compete in the top domestic league in the first place

 

[Tom]

Just not gonna agree on this to be fair, because i believe it is fair since it gives everyone a fair chance rather than those who are in it year on year and therefore, are the only ones who can get into it.

But still, at least an intelligent thread on SG for once.

 

[goal_machine84]

Well, i think its fair enough that the FA cup winners are given UEFA cup spot...but to take it to the next level (aka CL), that is just unfair to the teams in the top domestic league

I just think winning 30+ games over a long gruelling season warrants a CL spot more than wining 6 games in a row

 

[Augustus]

Good, let's take into account last season results for the top leagues in Europe, the ones that (presumably) will benefit from this format change. The national cups winners are...

Spain -> Sevilla -> already qualified, CL spot to Valencia (4th in the League)
England -> Chelsea -> already qualified, CL spot to Arsenal (4th in the League)
Italy -> Roma -> already qualified, CL spot to Lazio (3rd in the League), Milan, 4th in the table, enters CL as the holders
France -> Sochaux -> Sochaux finished the league in 7th position, 1 point behind Toulouse (3rd), actual CL 3rd qual contender
Germany -> Nurnberg -> Nurnberg finished the league in 6th position

Personally, I cannot see any QPR, or Pisa, or Rayo Vallecano, or Montpellier, or St. Pauli here...

 

[Augustus]

...and here the recent winners of those cups...

Copa del Rey
2000 Espanyol
2001 Zaragoza
2002 Deportivo
2003 Mallorca
2004 Zaragoza
2005 Betis
2006 Espanyol
2007 Sevilla

FA Cup
2000 Chelsea
2001 Liverpool
2002 Arsenal
2003 Arsenal
2004 Manchester United
2005 Arsenal
2006 Liverpool
2007 Chelsea

Coppa Italia
2000 Lazio
2001 Fiorentina
2002 Parma
2003 Milan
2004 Lazio
2005 Inter
2006 Inter
2007 Roma

Coupe de France
2000 Nantes
2001 Strasbourg
2002 Lorient
2003 Auxerre
2004 PSG
2005 Auxerre
2006 PSG
2007 Sochaux

DFB Pokal
2000 Bayern
2001 Schalke
2002 Schalke
2003 Bayern
2004 Werder
2005 Bayern
2006 Bayern
2007 Nurnberg

 

[Tom]

Yeah and if that happens it just goes to the fourth placed team, so what?

I don't susbsribe to this crap "give it to the runner up" thing. Like Millwall did NOT deserve to get in the UEFA cup a few years back.

 

[snoppf1]

I think everyone is forgetting points here

If a team wins the league and wins the cup,i assume the cl spot will open up to the team that finished 4th again

Secound point is, 6 years ago the top '4' teams in england were

Man united
Arsenal
Leeds
Newcastle(i think, might have been chelsea but the toon were on the up anyway)

As you know times change, bankrupcy, debt and a few foreign billionaires have shaked up the top 4 since then

I look at the epl now, i really did believe last year the top 4 (including us gooners) were far too comfortable with this top4 cl league spots. and adding incentive though the fa cup hopefully will inspire strong teams like man city, newcastle etc... to go win it and take a place in the cl

Barca had a disgusting season in 2002/03, next season they reshaped their team, got back into the cl and now people say their the best club side in the world (people say)

Same seems to be happening with bayern this year.

The biggest point is that i think teams like us (arsenal, spurs) instead of thinking, lets hope for a good season, top2 a cup etc... we would have to go out to win the league, knowing that 4th place likely will be nothing to fall back on

This idea is a masterstroke imo i hope it starts from next season

 

[$teauA]

On another note this move would pretty much be the end of the UEFA Cup. That competition would only be left with 'losers' which, now that I think about it would make it what it was when it was started so maybe it's not so bad after all since the UEFA Cup was WAY better back in the day.

I agree with whoever said that the best format was the three cup format (CL, CWC, UC) that was ace .

I think that this is a good idea and like Tom says, it gives smaller teams a chance to bring in some really serious dough and maybe eventually create some parity in the league. Not a bad idea from Platini.

 

[snoppf1]

i loved the cup winners cup

although it was a bit odd how a top team like liverpool would face a midtable team from switzerland

 

[Rocky]

Champion's league-Should only be for the Champions of each league. Only time a team outside 1st place should qualify is if the defending champs don't finish first in their league. I liked the idea about the Uefa Cup champs being boosted into the CL.
Uefa Cup-runners up of the league. Should restore some honor back into the "Losers cup", it use to kick ass back in the day.
Cup Winners Cup-The winners of each domestic cup qualify.

That's how I would personally like it, just like the good old days. Should restore some of the great teams like Steaua who were phased out by UEFA just because they didn't play in a big league.

 

[$teauA]

Champion's league-Should only be for the Champions of each league. Only time a team outside 1st place should qualify is if the defending champs don't finish first in their league. I liked the idea about the Uefa Cup champs being boosted into the CL.
Uefa Cup-runners up of the league. Should restore some honor back into the "Losers cup", it use to kick ass back in the day.
Cup Winners Cup-The winners of each domestic cup qualify.

That's how I would personally like it, just like the good old days. Should restore some of the great teams like Steaua who were phased out by UEFA just because they didn't play in a big league.

Nice to get some respect, thank you sir

We're slowly getting back up there, Champions League groups two years in a row now

 

[Fallen]

Hmm, it would be fair that only the national leagues champions play in the CL. The system used till 1996/97 (maybe later, i don't know since i didn't follow much even sice) was the best. One team per country, 4 groups of 4 teams each. We had Blackburn Rovers in CL, we had Borussia Dortmund, Widzew Lodz (Poland), Ferencsvaros(Hungary), Steaua, and many other teams that today just don't fit in the BIG league, cause of the huge nr of english, italian, spanish, german teams ...

The champion in each country + the winner of the CL last season + winner of the Cup Winners Cup + winner of UEFA Cup should be the only teams allowed to participate in the CL.

All teams above, except the CL, UEFA and CWC winners in the previous season should be forced to play preliminary rounds, 1-2 depending on their coefficient...

Cup Winners Cup should be reinstated and given big importance, money comparable to CL. This would make domestic cups to mean much much more.

UEFA Cup should be the competition for the teams ranked 2nd and 3rd in the leagues. If a team ranked 2nd or 3rd in it's league won the domestic cup, it will play in CWC, not in UEFA (just like it used to be) and then the 4th team would take its place in the UEFA Cup.

As UEFA Officials managed to transform the CL in the competition it is today, i think they can make a miracle and rise CWC from its ashes and make it shine again ...

 

[LDD]

They already get richely rewarded for it by winning the cup and playing European football(mostly). But I want to see the best clubs in the best club competition in the world. Not some obscure club who accidently had a lucky winning streak the previous season.

You would rather see some lucky team that his league gets out of the hat some sort of playoff thing to guaranty them chances to play in the CL, and end up losing in the qualifications two years in a row?


Look a champion is a champion, and the thing with the cups is that everybody has a shot, fair and square

 

[Zlatan]

From your minimal English I can make up that you're talking about the playoffs. Well, who says I support the play-offs in our league? Everyone in our country that has a bit of brains says it's not a fair system, but it brings more games and thus more money that's why it's been introduced. It'll probably cease to exist after this season. The number one will go directly to the CL and the second best to the qualifying round. This way, both will show that they're the best our county has to offer by playing 34 games in a row consitently and thus getting the 1st and 2nd spot. Because of this they're the best clubs of our country. And all country's best clubs, decided by 30+ games in a tough season, should have the right to play in the CL and not Cambuur Leeuwarden who had a lucky draw and ended up with the cup in their hands.

 

[Lean]

The chance at glory is already given by giving them a UEFA cup spot as help? said...i agree that by giving FA cup winners a CL spot, there will be some variety in the matches and lots of "different stuff" and it will help the level of football in those teams...the players of a lower league team can get invaluable experience playing on the biggest european stage and get noticed plus the financial gains to the clubs will give a boost to their future plans

But, i believe that "Champions" League should remain Champions League....in other words the top 4 in the top domestic league have earned their right to be there.....afterall, even Man Utd was once relegated....the fans support, great managers and gradual success eventually landed them a CL spot.....that is wat it takes to be in the CL

I just cant support the idea of FA cup winners being given CL spots....it will be unfair to the top division teams who have battled so hard to compete in the top domestic league in the first place

I see your point, but at least on England's case the top clubs outspend all the other clubs in the league by themselves and have a clear edge. A smaller club is never going to have a chance. By having the cup winner get a shot at glory, the competitiveness of football in general is likely to rise since those clubs will get more money and will be able to invest more.

Clubs battle hard in the league but the position they managed earns them way more money (at least in the Premiership's case), and they also have the chance to invest. With a good squad they will be able to compete in the cup, so when they realise they dont have a chance in the league, they will give it all for the cup. It's not going to harm the league and it's going to make the cup an interesting competition. Not only on England but everywhere else.

 

[LDD]

From your minimal English I can make up that you're talking about the playoffs. Well, who says I support the play-offs in our league? Everyone in our country that has a bit of brains says it's not a fair system, but it brings more games and thus more money that's why it's been introduced. It'll probably cease to exist after this season. The number one will go directly to the CL and the second best to the qualifying round. This way, both will show that they're the best our county has to offer by playing 34 games in a row consitently and thus getting the 1st and 2nd spot. Because of this they're the best clubs of our country. And all country's best clubs, decided by 30+ games in a tough season, should have the right to play in the CL and not Cambuur Leeuwarden who had a lucky draw and ended up with the cup in their hands.

One lucky draw doesn't make you champion, they actually faced someone on the pitch, it's not like the powerhouses were ruled out from the start. Anyway, I won't put asterisks next to final cups saying "Be aware those were some lucky bastards" instead of giving proper recognition to a winning run

 

[Zlatan]

Look my lad, last year our cup-winner had 5 weak teams before finally meeting a real opponent in the final. It's not so impossible for a smal(ler) club to reach the final and win it. The FA Cup might be competitive enough, ours just quite frankly isn't. I don't know what's wrong with you if you rather have Cambuur Leeuwarden than Ajax, Feyenoord, PSV or AZ in the CL, or Millwall instead of Liverpool, Arsenal, Man Utd, Chelsea or Aachen instead of Bayern, Werder, Schalke, Stuttgart or...

Those clubs who won the cup have fought well and therefore should be rewarded, I agree. But they already get rewarded by reaching the UEFA Cup and eternal glory by winning the cup in the first place.

 

[LDD]

It's a sport mate, crucial moments, overcoming, underdogs ... And there's always a next season. Don't turn the CL into a restrictive club were a quarter of the teams have won nothing in years.

 

[Sevillista]

It will be impossible to "get lucky" in the Cup if everybody in it is fighting for a CL spot.