ShawshankRed
Youth Team
well, I just got a router and it seems I'm finally going to have all the problems you guys have. Is there new solutions out? I need help
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Router Problem Solved yet?
- Thread starter ShawshankRed
- Start date
ShawshankRed
Youth Team
bump
ShawshankRed
Youth Team
Ok, thanks everyone. You are far too kind
Frommelgoal
Youth Team
Still no fix as far as I know.
Konami announced a new patch for the XboX that should be out in the coming weeks. A new PC patch has been rumoured, but never officially confirmed.
Konami announced a new patch for the XboX that should be out in the coming weeks. A new PC patch has been rumoured, but never officially confirmed.
ShawshankRed
Youth Team
maybe it'll be fixed in Winning Eleven 8. Man, there is no way to play with a router?
A lot of people use routers and it's fine. Follow the port forwarding instructions.
However, I have one friend who I just can not get a game going with... and we have no idea why... The PCs talk to each other, I accept his challenge, then it says "disconnected"
Not good...
DALE
However, I have one friend who I just can not get a game going with... and we have no idea why... The PCs talk to each other, I accept his challenge, then it says "disconnected"
Not good...
DALE
ShawshankRed
Youth Team
Man, I can't follow that instruction good. My router is wired.
I need step by step instructions and that typing address in Mozzila doesn't work
I need step by step instructions and that typing address in Mozzila doesn't work
ShawshankRed
Youth Team
anyone?
ShawshankRed
Youth Team
what is DMZ mode, can u give us more info.
Frommelgoal
Youth Team
DMZ = DeMilitarized Zone.
What it does is open all the ports on your router, so it will be just like the router is not there. In theory, that should bypass all router trouble, but will keep your computer unprotected.
Unfortunately, I didn't get any progress using a DMZ with my router as a client.
What it does is open all the ports on your router, so it will be just like the router is not there. In theory, that should bypass all router trouble, but will keep your computer unprotected.
Unfortunately, I didn't get any progress using a DMZ with my router as a client.
Two of my mates had routers and couldn't play PES4.
Both of them have now DMZ themselves...
now one mate can play fine, both host & client, but the poor other mate can only play as client but can not host! So it's still not fixed it.
Although they've both bought the game they are using No-CD cracks. Could that be the problem?? Although they prefer not to have to put the CD in the drive each time they would be happy to use the original EXE as long as it works!
So... please could you people with problems tell me: are you using NOCD cracks? or using the original EXE?
I need to know if it is the nocd that is causing the real problem...
Thanks
DALE
EDIT: I just tried to play my brother and we simply could not get a game going. He can host and client and I can do both too, nomally, yet we couldn't play against each other. This indicates it's the nocd crack we're using... yet I then went on to play some other people fine who were also using the nocd patch! agghh! this is driving me nuts. What can I try? The only reason my brother just bought a new PC was to play me at this game!!!
DALE
Both of them have now DMZ themselves...
now one mate can play fine, both host & client, but the poor other mate can only play as client but can not host! So it's still not fixed it.
Although they've both bought the game they are using No-CD cracks. Could that be the problem?? Although they prefer not to have to put the CD in the drive each time they would be happy to use the original EXE as long as it works!
So... please could you people with problems tell me: are you using NOCD cracks? or using the original EXE?
I need to know if it is the nocd that is causing the real problem...
Thanks
DALE
EDIT: I just tried to play my brother and we simply could not get a game going. He can host and client and I can do both too, nomally, yet we couldn't play against each other. This indicates it's the nocd crack we're using... yet I then went on to play some other people fine who were also using the nocd patch! agghh! this is driving me nuts. What can I try? The only reason my brother just bought a new PC was to play me at this game!!!
DALE
ShawshankRed
Youth Team
Ok, cool.
I knew it wasn't the no-cd.
You know I can connect my modem straight into my comp whenever I want cause the other comp is not always being used but I don't want to do that. I want to use the game online behind router
I knew it wasn't the no-cd.
You know I can connect my modem straight into my comp whenever I want cause the other comp is not always being used but I don't want to do that. I want to use the game online behind router
This is what my mate did to "fix" my brothers:
--------------
First I disabled windows firewall and told
it I was monitoring my own firewall.
Next I changed the LAN settings on the router - I tried initially to set up static IPs on the PC but couldn't find the ISPs DNS server addresses
anywhere so instead I set the DHCP address range to user defined and changed the range itself to 10.0.0.14 to 10.0.0.14 - therefore the only address which can be assigned is 10.0.0.14. The reason I used 14 is because that's
the number you'd forwarded the ports too - it may be different on your mates pc.
I set the lease time to all zeros. Router firewall disabled - this really shouldn't matter since the router is using NAT anyway.
I think that was it
----------------------
This allowed me to finally play my brother at PES - however it wasn't perfect as he could only host but not client. So then I put his router into DMZ and then it worked fine both ways (host and client)
It's not ideal as the router gives no protection now, but before it wouldn't work at all, even with it in DMZ, I am not sure why what my mate did made any difference but it did.
My brother bought a PC JUST to play PES onine - so now he is very happy. I just got to teach him to put the XP firewall back on after playing, and to do regular virus & spyware scans
Shawshank - I have a feeling this "fix" isn't going to be any good for you, if you are using more than one PC. Sorry.
DALE
--------------
First I disabled windows firewall and told
it I was monitoring my own firewall.
Next I changed the LAN settings on the router - I tried initially to set up static IPs on the PC but couldn't find the ISPs DNS server addresses
anywhere so instead I set the DHCP address range to user defined and changed the range itself to 10.0.0.14 to 10.0.0.14 - therefore the only address which can be assigned is 10.0.0.14. The reason I used 14 is because that's
the number you'd forwarded the ports too - it may be different on your mates pc.
I set the lease time to all zeros. Router firewall disabled - this really shouldn't matter since the router is using NAT anyway.
I think that was it
----------------------
This allowed me to finally play my brother at PES - however it wasn't perfect as he could only host but not client. So then I put his router into DMZ and then it worked fine both ways (host and client)
It's not ideal as the router gives no protection now, but before it wouldn't work at all, even with it in DMZ, I am not sure why what my mate did made any difference but it did.
My brother bought a PC JUST to play PES onine - so now he is very happy. I just got to teach him to put the XP firewall back on after playing, and to do regular virus & spyware scans
Shawshank - I have a feeling this "fix" isn't going to be any good for you, if you are using more than one PC. Sorry.
DALE
long time ago i tried opening a range of ports (i think from 1024-10000 or something like that) so i can client (5739 UDP seems to only work for hosting) and it worked. However after watching my norton catch up stuff on a daily basis i am not going to leave these ports opened. So that means that there is another hidden port that needs to be opened for clienting. Assuming this port doesn't change, it is possible to figure it out using trial and error method. Just pick a reasonable range and cut it in half, if nothing happens try the other half and so on, every time narrowing it down. It is very easy to do and should not take more than an hour as u can just keep the pes4 window minimized. So if anybody is willing to cooperate, my AIM is Nemetsz or just email me at [email protected]
cheers
cheers
Frommelgoal
Youth Team
Or you download a port monitor, so you can see it directly! 
But I think it's been tried and the result was that the port was changed every time.
But I think it's been tried and the result was that the port was changed every time.
Hi everyone,
I can 100% confirm siGht's and
Frommelgoal's posts above. In fact, I may be very near to a solution, I'll hopefully know in the next few days.
I've gone through a number of steps which I will outline below.
I used the wonderful GPL Packet Sniffer "Ethereal" ( http://www.ethereal.com/) to listen and record packets when starting games of PES4 with a friend where I could be HOST and he could be CLIENT and we could have a successful game. We only noticed the problem when we tried to reverse roles, him as HOST, me as CLIENT and the game would not start. This, it turned out when I read lots of forums, is a common problem.
Okay, so what do I know about packets sent during PES4 connection:
1) Person as HOST: when waiting for a game the prog simply sits and waits for a CLIENT to connect. Does not seem to send out any packets.
2) Person as CLIENT:
i) when trying to connect client sends UDP packets TO (this is the important part) destination port 5739 at the host IP address entered. (You can use ethereal to test this and use a bogus IP address... PES4 will still try to connect and send UDP packets). As a test I ran the game settings link in the start menu (not the in-game settings) and changed the UDP port. Whatever I changed the UDP port to, the UDP packet is sent TO that port on the destination machine. So far so good.
ii) BUT: When looking at the packets ethereal recorded there was a problem. Every UDP packet was headed to the correct IP address on the correct port (UDP 5739) but the SOURCE of the packet on the client machine was a different UDP port. Even crazier, was the fact that each time the connection failed (or was cut) and then an attempt was made to reconnect, the CLIENT program used a COMLETLEY DIFFERENT SOURCE PORT (re-inforcing siGht's observations).
Also, for each new connection tried (without quitting PES4) the UPD port changes by going up in small increments... ie one game it would be something like (and I am making these ports up as I don't have the ethereal output in front of me) 6031 and then the next try to connect (after that one failed) would be on 6035.
If the CLIENT's game was shut down, and then restarted it would be a dramatically different port (like 8050 or something) and then for each try would once again increment up. I will refer to this changing port as PORT X.
-----
Okay, so what ramifications does this have for successful connection? Well, if you are not behind a router and use no firewall or a software firewall you can tell it to autodetect and allow all ports in and out that PES4 wants to use and you have no problems (ie, people NOT behind routers often have no problem joinng or hosting).
BUT if you are behind a router then you MUST configure the ports specifically for each game. This is why enabling DMZ works for some people, as the router passes all traffic along, rather than processing it against the firewall rules. The DMZ option allows the local machine to deal with blocking or allowing specific ports. Although we know that enabling DMZ still does not work for everyone.
SO, to get things to work (in theory):
a) The CLIENT needs to be able to SEND TO port 5739 on the HOST. This means if you are behind a router you need to ensure the OUTGOING PORT udp 5739 is open.
b) The CLIENT needs to be able to RECEIVE udp packets on PORT X (and possibly port 5739 as well, i got some weird results with ethereal that could be the initial gamestart 'handshake'.. so I need to check this). This means if you are behind a router you need to open INCOMING PORT X (and possibly port 5739) to allow incoming packets from the HOST to reach you on your weird random port x.
c) The HOST needs to be able to RECEIVE packets on port 5739 from the CLIENT. This means if you are behind a router you need to ensure the INCOMING PORT udp 5739 is open.
d) The HOST needs to be able to SEND udp packets TO PORT X (and possibly port 5739). This means if you are behind a router you need to open PORT X (and possibly port 5739) to allow OUTGOING packets from the HOST to reach PORT X on the client.
It becomes very clear that for a successful game behind routers PORT X must be known , and not only that, be allowed every game!!!
To make matters worse, if you set up ethereal to sniff packets during gamestart, you'll find there is a finite time before the client times out and stops trying to connect. If by this time the router(s) have not been configured you'll need to do it all over again as the client source port will change upon the next time you try to connect.
The other problem, is that in trying this (and I have only tried once) we ran into other problems, so we didn't get to thoroughly test this.
siGht's idea to open a range of ports is a good one, and will help to cater for the mystical PORT X, but it is not ideal from a security perspective.
There is ONE other option that I am testing tight now, and that is using packet tunneling software to set up a VPN to forward a range of udp ports through ONE KNOWN PORT. I have not done extensive testing yet, but it looks promising!
NOTE:
I tested the packets of some other games I own that only require one port to be open for netplay to occur. This was to ensure that for these games, they only require the use of one port. As I expected, the SOURCE and DESTINATION ports for all the packets were the same.
THUS, I come to the conclusion that either KONAMI have no idea about PC network gaming and the importance of forwarding the CORRECT port...
OR...
there is a massive bug in their code that causes the client's source port (PORT X) to be random (well, not random, the way that it increments suggests that some variable within the game code is being modified in a consistent [even if unintended] manner).
I'd say the reason this has gone unnoticed by KONAMI (even after the bug has been reported) is because in-house testing does not need to worry about opening or closing specific ports on their internal network, it will seem to work until you need to forward packets when behind a router.
I'll let you all know about how the port tunnel stuff goes this weekend. In the meantime, if anyone knows someone on the PES4 team over at KONAMI can you let them know about all of this for me?!
Cheers,
Hali
I can 100% confirm siGht's and
Frommelgoal's posts above. In fact, I may be very near to a solution, I'll hopefully know in the next few days.
I've gone through a number of steps which I will outline below.
I used the wonderful GPL Packet Sniffer "Ethereal" ( http://www.ethereal.com/) to listen and record packets when starting games of PES4 with a friend where I could be HOST and he could be CLIENT and we could have a successful game. We only noticed the problem when we tried to reverse roles, him as HOST, me as CLIENT and the game would not start. This, it turned out when I read lots of forums, is a common problem.
Okay, so what do I know about packets sent during PES4 connection:
1) Person as HOST: when waiting for a game the prog simply sits and waits for a CLIENT to connect. Does not seem to send out any packets.
2) Person as CLIENT:
i) when trying to connect client sends UDP packets TO (this is the important part) destination port 5739 at the host IP address entered. (You can use ethereal to test this and use a bogus IP address... PES4 will still try to connect and send UDP packets). As a test I ran the game settings link in the start menu (not the in-game settings) and changed the UDP port. Whatever I changed the UDP port to, the UDP packet is sent TO that port on the destination machine. So far so good.
ii) BUT: When looking at the packets ethereal recorded there was a problem. Every UDP packet was headed to the correct IP address on the correct port (UDP 5739) but the SOURCE of the packet on the client machine was a different UDP port. Even crazier, was the fact that each time the connection failed (or was cut) and then an attempt was made to reconnect, the CLIENT program used a COMLETLEY DIFFERENT SOURCE PORT (re-inforcing siGht's observations).
Also, for each new connection tried (without quitting PES4) the UPD port changes by going up in small increments... ie one game it would be something like (and I am making these ports up as I don't have the ethereal output in front of me) 6031 and then the next try to connect (after that one failed) would be on 6035.
If the CLIENT's game was shut down, and then restarted it would be a dramatically different port (like 8050 or something) and then for each try would once again increment up. I will refer to this changing port as PORT X.
-----
Okay, so what ramifications does this have for successful connection? Well, if you are not behind a router and use no firewall or a software firewall you can tell it to autodetect and allow all ports in and out that PES4 wants to use and you have no problems (ie, people NOT behind routers often have no problem joinng or hosting).
BUT if you are behind a router then you MUST configure the ports specifically for each game. This is why enabling DMZ works for some people, as the router passes all traffic along, rather than processing it against the firewall rules. The DMZ option allows the local machine to deal with blocking or allowing specific ports. Although we know that enabling DMZ still does not work for everyone.
SO, to get things to work (in theory):
a) The CLIENT needs to be able to SEND TO port 5739 on the HOST. This means if you are behind a router you need to ensure the OUTGOING PORT udp 5739 is open.
b) The CLIENT needs to be able to RECEIVE udp packets on PORT X (and possibly port 5739 as well, i got some weird results with ethereal that could be the initial gamestart 'handshake'.. so I need to check this). This means if you are behind a router you need to open INCOMING PORT X (and possibly port 5739) to allow incoming packets from the HOST to reach you on your weird random port x.
c) The HOST needs to be able to RECEIVE packets on port 5739 from the CLIENT. This means if you are behind a router you need to ensure the INCOMING PORT udp 5739 is open.
d) The HOST needs to be able to SEND udp packets TO PORT X (and possibly port 5739). This means if you are behind a router you need to open PORT X (and possibly port 5739) to allow OUTGOING packets from the HOST to reach PORT X on the client.
It becomes very clear that for a successful game behind routers PORT X must be known , and not only that, be allowed every game!!!
To make matters worse, if you set up ethereal to sniff packets during gamestart, you'll find there is a finite time before the client times out and stops trying to connect. If by this time the router(s) have not been configured you'll need to do it all over again as the client source port will change upon the next time you try to connect.
The other problem, is that in trying this (and I have only tried once) we ran into other problems, so we didn't get to thoroughly test this.
siGht's idea to open a range of ports is a good one, and will help to cater for the mystical PORT X, but it is not ideal from a security perspective.
There is ONE other option that I am testing tight now, and that is using packet tunneling software to set up a VPN to forward a range of udp ports through ONE KNOWN PORT. I have not done extensive testing yet, but it looks promising!
NOTE:
I tested the packets of some other games I own that only require one port to be open for netplay to occur. This was to ensure that for these games, they only require the use of one port. As I expected, the SOURCE and DESTINATION ports for all the packets were the same.
THUS, I come to the conclusion that either KONAMI have no idea about PC network gaming and the importance of forwarding the CORRECT port...
OR...
there is a massive bug in their code that causes the client's source port (PORT X) to be random (well, not random, the way that it increments suggests that some variable within the game code is being modified in a consistent [even if unintended] manner).
I'd say the reason this has gone unnoticed by KONAMI (even after the bug has been reported) is because in-house testing does not need to worry about opening or closing specific ports on their internal network, it will seem to work until you need to forward packets when behind a router.
I'll let you all know about how the port tunnel stuff goes this weekend. In the meantime, if anyone knows someone on the PES4 team over at KONAMI can you let them know about all of this for me?!
Cheers,
Hali