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Who's The Greatest Player? RIVALDO...

R

Ric

Guest
Elninho... very accurate post! I agree 100%.

Besides all of that, Sampson did something else that a coach should never, ever do... he publicly blasted ex-players.

The minute I heard him open his big fat trap like that, he had zero respect from me.

In my book, he’s easily the WORST coach (and I use that term loosely I guess) to ever lead a team into a World Cup.
 
B

Baggio

Guest
Firstly, Galo's line of reasoning is not logical, in fact he just proves my point. The reason why there is no one now that stands way out from everyone else is because everyone's skill levels have improved. Its harder now for a player to stand out because in today's time most players have that same level of skill...To pick the greatest player today you have to go beyond appearance and look at their depth of perception of the game..

On that note i'll argue any day that Baggio is a better player than Ronaldo or Rivaldo for that matter..They are tricky players, both of them, what do you expect they are from Brazil..But the both of them lack the intelligence and leadership skills to carry a team....Baggio did that in both 90 and 94 world cup for Italy.

I am yet to see Ronaldo do something to prove his worth...
As for Rivaldo, he has some good touches but he can't control a game..he's too selfish..

SoFrEdOr, did i read right, did you say Del Piero? Have you forgotten the last world cup already? Del Piero,the one who was suppose to replace the great Roberto Baggio.. But what happened, Baggio scraped in into the sqaud and ended up being one of best players on the team that year beside Vieri, Cannavaro, and Moriero....

Where was Del Piero?? You are going to argue injury aren't you...But Baggio was injured in 94 and still kept on playing to carry his side.
One of the biggest problems the Italian National team is having is that they have failed to replace Baggio but yet are trying to do without him...He is the best creative player Italy has and will ever see...

You ask any real football expert to compare any of the players you guys mentioned with Baggio and they will agree that Baggio has more understanding of the game and his foresight is way above theirs as well...

[This message has been edited by Baggio (edited 10-13-1999).]

[This message has been edited by Baggio (edited 10-13-1999).]
 
G

Galo

Guest
And who do you consider "football experts'? Because I watch football programs all the time,and read all the magazines,and those experts constantly say Pele is the best EVER,and still say Ronaldo and Roberto Carlos are two of the best these days. They havent said great things about Baggio since the World Cup 98 era. And I quote " Roberto Baggio is my prediction for Italy's star in this world cup. He has the heart and motivation to take Italy all the way."
There you have it. The last time Baggio was focused on and praised by true football experts. Maybe there in Italy they still talke about him,but of course,thats his country!!

BTW Sofredor: I am from Belo Horizonte,Minas Gerais. I support the great Clube Atletico Mineiro(Galo)
 
S

SoFrEdOr

Guest
The Galo thing I figured out... Anyway... the last image I have in my head of Baggio is that penalty... HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! That was so sweet...
 
B

Baggio

Guest
I just want you guys to know that i don't mean to offend, if i have...Its really fun arguing with you guys and if you guys ever want to argue a new topic i'll be honoured..
ANYWAYS...
SoFrEdOr, Galo, the last image i have of Ronaldo was him in the last wolrd cup finals..the look on that guy's face when Zidane scored those two goals to shove the player of the year trophy in his face...Man was that good!!!!

Where is Ronaldo now???

If you want to hear about Baggio just click on espn.com and you'll see an article on him..Ronaldo was the player of the year whenever, but now he is no good...

To make it worse his form before his sickness was no good either...His best days were back at Barcelona and against those spanish defenders anyone can look good, even Klivert...

As for the penalty, i have seen great players do worse...If you look back at Baggio's highlights that would probably be the only mistake he ever made on the field...I am sure i could find a few for Pele..definitely more than Baggio

Me, mi stil seh Baggio fi mi money...Sorry but that's just the Jamaican in me coming out....
 
H

Hagi

Guest
I'm surprised that u forget to say a little bit about Hagi. U saw him on stadium ? He is natural. When u say Rivaldo I can imagine a Porche, but HAGI is like a RollsRoyce, is mature and has everything.

By, Hagi.
 
S

SoFrEdOr

Guest
Baggio,

I would just like to inform you that Ronaldo is not the best player in the world in my opinion, so cut the crap. And ESPN?? What the hell do they know about footbal, or should I say "soccer"?? The only football they know is the one you play with the hands carrying an egg-shaped "ball". Rivaldo's the man to this year... And if anybody thinks Zidane is better, you've just lost my respect...
 
B

Baggio

Guest
Hagi, definitely..He has so much understanding of the game...I love the way he plays..too bad he's getting a bit older...I wish i could see more of him, a move to Italian or Spanish league would do him some good..
He reminded me so much of Baggio the first world cup he played along side Lacatus(is that spelling correct???)..
Yeah he would get my vote as one of the greatest...but sorry still not over Baggio..
Sorry Hagi..
 
B

Baggio

Guest
Yo SoFrEdOr calm down yo, i didn't say Zidane was better. I just said that Ronaldo has made some stupid plays on the feild as well, it's unfair to judge a player off of one mistake..

Baggio missed a penalty and Ronaldo was no where to be found on the feild in the 98 finals..That's all..

But Where Rivaldo is concerned, come on...I will agree with you on the this year thing, he's having a great year, but to compare him to Baggio...I think not man.

Rivaldo has one play in his book, collect the ball in midfield just above the 18, and look for the trusty old left foot...That's no talent to brag about really...

He can not play more than one role on the team, he lacks diversity..
If you feel so strongly about it give me your opinions on his good qualities as a great player...ok
 
E

edu

Guest
Baggio

Are u crazy, u cant see the skills of Rivaldo, the man can score from anywhere in the field, inside the box, outside the box and the passes, at least once every game he leaves his team mates face to face with the goalkeeper.

And whats so wrong with having a good left foot, baggio doesnt kick well with any of his feet, Ive seen games that he lost goals under the post, then theres free-kicks what was the last time baggio scored from a freekick, if rivaldo doesnt score from a freekick he always places the ball very near the goal, I never seen him freekick a ball out of the stadium like baggio does.

Now if u think having just one good foot isnt enough then u shouldnt say PELE wouldnt be so great today, because he could score with his left foot as easily as he would score with his right one
 
B

Baggio

Guest
Man am i making enimies fast..
edu,
Come off of the Rivaldo thing man, you just can't win.
Baggio from my knowledge has not skied a ball way off from a free kick execpt the penalty in 94..Big Woop. Again i say its his only mistake you can ever point out, the one time he has ever shown a sign of weakness..

Rivaldo on the other hand, i am just so tired of seeing him destroy the flow of Barcelona's game. Every match Rivaldo does the same thing, ever game. He waits in the center, collects the ball about midway half line and the 18, then pushes to the left, if covered cuts to the right(which will never fire) and then cuts back left to force off a shot..His shots are powerful but no real control(accuracy).

Baggio is more well known than Rivaldo is for his accuracy on free kicks my friend..If you have ever seen Baggio Take a free kick you would know that..His free kicks graze the head of the wall and dips suddenly below the cross bar..Come on yo, must i have to be telling you this??

As for the left footed thing with Pele, again so many players today use both feet interchangably...Which brings me back to my earlier point, that back in the old days Pele was seen as great because he could use both feet, today almost every player can do that...It just goes to show that the general skill level in the game has increased...So Its hard to compare Pele's accomplishments back then to someone more recent who has to face more difficult challenges..

Ses my point edu..??
 
E

edu

Guest
baggio are u crazy?

Since when Rivaldo kicks are that powerful, I think u are mixing rivaldo for r.carlos, Rivaldo is very accurate and not very powerfull, did u watch barcaVSr.madri that was one of his worst matches in the spanish league but he was able to score a goal by just placing the ball away from the keeper also in the same match he gave a perfect cross to the head of luis henrique but he was able to miss a very easy header that even roaldo could score, and what about free kicks, rivaldo scores from freekicks every 4 or 5 games, he scored he last free kick 3 games ago in the spanish league and one freekick goal in national team against Argentina, one game before HolandvsBrazil. Have u been watching the whole spanish season like I have bee watching the italian season? well maybe Im better informed since I watch the Italian season on RAI instead of espn.

And about kicking with both feet, well even I can do that, but scoring a GOAL every now and then like PELE, well not a single player can do that today, they might make a goal a year but pele did much more then that.
 
S

SoFrEdOr

Guest
Edu... You're obviously brazilian, so am I, and I have the same name as you too...

Pelé scored 1281 goals in 1375 official matches, which gives an average of =~0.8 goals per match... Can Baggio do this?? And if players were worse then, that's because they weren't trained well... Well, Pelé was no exception, so if he was trained like today, he would be even better, right?? Think about it.
 
E

Eleftherios

Youth Team
I would have to say that the majority of you r comments have been fair. Rivaldo is on fire at the moment. Batistuta and Owen look like the best strikers, I personally think Lazios Argentianian Midfielder Veron looks in scintilating form right now as does Australias Harry Kewell, watching Kewell play is like watching a poetry in motion. He breezes past players with an air of arrogance almost and his shot..? incredible to say te least it reminiscent of Ronald Koeman, the ball travels quickly through the air without spinning whilst its dipping and swerving!! brilliant and he's only 20 amazing. Defenders I would say Sol Campbell who looks like going to man united. Goal keepers, well it certainly is not Massimo Taibi! I believe its between van de Sar or still schmeichel. Hey Ric would you happen to know if the ball still travels with a curl all the when you hit he lob button or the shoot button, it s so unrealistic. Why cant EA have left long passing balls and some shots to travel in a straight line ala David Beckam 50 yarders. They could have a bend key to depress when you hit the lob or shoot button instead.
 
B

Baggio

Guest
Ohhh, i get this now,,,
ya all Brazillians!!!
edu, yo how did espn in get into this??
who watches espn for anything other than some champions league games???
Man relax..
Rivaldo is on a roll this year, but again you are comparing a player at his prime with a player whose skill has just started to level..
And please don't insult my intelligence man, Who on Earth doesn't know Rivaldo seperate from Roberto Carlos??

If you're to compare players i say we have to do it on a level playing field. That means we take them at the peak of their games..Rivaldo at his peak cannot be compared to Baggio at his peak man..Have you forgotten what Baggio is capable of?? In that case i say you go back to your so called higher source of information and check the tapes man...

And SoFrEdOr, fine, maybe if Pele had the training these players have today he would have been better, but it still stands that he's is and was not as good as some of the more recent players..Baggio to name one.

Any how man i refuse to debate this with two Brazillians yo,,,Is like you guys tellng me that Junior Baiano wasn't completely made a fool of by Whitmore when he had to break his nose in last year's Gold Cup match between Jamaica and Brazil..we would argue non stop on that one too...

So i appologize if i have offended your nation yo..I guess when you're from Brazil there's no one greater than a Brazillian..huh
The next time i will try arguing this with a European and see if i can get anywhere..

In conclusion, ya all are biased yo...

[This message has been edited by Baggio (edited 10-15-1999).]

[This message has been edited by Baggio (edited 10-15-1999).]
 
E

edu

Guest
Im not a brazilian Im from Portugal, and dont say that rivaldo is in his prime because he has been playing like that since he was playing in Brazil and to me Baggio onlt had a few good seasons.

If u think PELE cant be that good today because back then all the players werent good or that well fit then the same would aply to baggio he used to be good back when the Italian season didnt have so many great international players but know his just an average player, and dont tell me how baggio was great cause since u dont buy that with PELE why should I buy that from a player that didnt even win 3 wourld cups. Come on he didnt even win a world cup how can he be such a great players, I dont even consider RIVALDO the greatest because he didnt win enough titles.

ps:If hes such a great kicker what was the last time baggio scored with his other feet and also when was his last Freekick goal.

[This message has been edited by edu (edited 10-15-1999).]
 
L

Lupos

Guest
It's incredible! 77 replyes to this topic and nobody(NOBODY!)mentioned TOTTI!!! HE WAS THE BEST ITALIAN PLAYER last season!! Ok, i'm a supporter of A.S. ROME (not Lazio please..) but he was voted as i told you (in one of the best (if not the best) championship in the world.. ok i told u..
and now the best players for me:

goalkeeper: Buffon or Peruzzi (if he's not injured.. )
defender: Thuram
midfield: Veron
advanced midfielder: Totti (u didn't know that, ah?)

forward: Rivaldo or Vieri
 
Z

Zambrotta

Guest
HEY, after 77 busts, here CICCO TOTTI gets 2 votes in a row. Wanna know why no one knows him?

1st: Morons always think if a guy from Brazil is medium to good he is automatically the no.1 player. Pele ain't nothing to MARADONA.

2nd: As the SERIE A is so good, people diss' it and say crap a la "FAPL is better". Knowing they are LIARS they then say that everything the Italians win is merit of the foreigners only. WAKE UP. Zola is 34 and old and half dead and still rocks the FAPL. In Italy he would be on Cagliari's bench.

3rd: Roma ain't so popular, people only know Juve, Inter and Milan abroad. It's sad, but that's it.

Honestly: HOW CAN ANYONE SAY THAT RIVALDO IS BETTER THAN PAOLO MALDINI?
 
Z

Zambrotta

Guest
Hey EDU:

BAGGIO is (was) so much better than RIVALDO is (will always be), and you know it.

 
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