Will the Korea fiasco happen in 2006?

[pasion1]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=XWXfAZc67Do&search=japan world cup

very very interesting. A FIFA DVD showing the famous "Bad calls" that helped Korea go to Semi finals.

Though I still think the Totti red card was valid (he was already falling before the Korean stretched his leg)

But yeah, this is almost as bad as England (and Also Germany in the Qfinal) in England 1966 (Except Korea didnt go on to win 2002 ).

But I think that people will be looking at refs with a magnifiying glass this time and it might not happen.

 

[newbie original]

No, the Korea fiasco will not happen in 2006.

 

[gasper000]

lol Korea will not even qualify for the 2nd round
in 2002 it was just luck

 

[TheBlueBalla]

That Totti card and that Joaquin cross were absolute disgraces. I forgot how egregious those awful calls were. The ref is 20 yards away but decides its simulation? The linesman is at the corner and misses that call? That was comical

 

[pede54]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=XWXfAZc67Do&search=japan world cup

very very interesting. A FIFA DVD showing the famous "Bad calls" that helped Korea go to Semi finals.

Though I still think the Totti red card was valid (he was already falling before the Korean stretched his leg)

But yeah, this is almost as bad as England (and Also Germany in the Qfinal) in England 1966 (Except Korea didnt go on to win 2002 ).

But I think that people will be looking at refs with a magnifiying glass this time and it might not happen.

Sorry man, but how do you equate the Korean World Cup with the 1966 World Cup? I am very curious as to why you choose this event rather than France '98, or probably 10 other World Cups where home advantage has resulted in the home nation winning the trophy. The only controversy in the entire 1966 World Cup was the disputed 3rd England goal in the final, which in the end proved to be uninportant as England scored a fourth anyway.

If the final was so biased, then why would the ref have awarded the Germans a free kick on the edge of Englands area one minute from time, that they scored from to force extra time? The ref even turned away a legitimate handball appeal from the England players before that equaliser hit the back of the net.

The only other controversy I remember in 1966, was the first time I had seen an International team kick, spit and dive their way through a football match. It was Argentina. The first time ever that a player in England,( Rattin) after being shown a red card, had to be escorted off the field by the police because he refused to go. This country had never seen behaviour like it before then.

 

[ShearerM4]

The ref even turned away a legitimate handball appeal from the England players before that equaliser hit the back of the net.

ah the good old handlball ... most people don't even know about that. Quite shocking it was too! The Germans got right back into the game thanks to that goal as well.

 

[henry#14]

Man I hope some more nonsense like this doesn't happen. Actually, I think Byron Moreno, THAT linesman, is back for this WC

 

[pasion1]

Sorry man, but how do you equate the Korean World Cup with the 1966 World Cup? I am very curious as to why you choose this event rather than France '98, or probably 10 other World Cups where home advantage has resulted in the home nation winning the trophy. The only controversy in the entire 1966 World Cup was the disputed 3rd England goal in the final, which in the end proved to be uninportant as England scored a fourth anyway.

If the final was so biased, then why would the ref have awarded the Germans a free kick on the edge of Englands area one minute from time, that they scored from to force extra time? The ref even turned away a legitimate handball appeal from the England players before that equaliser hit the back of the net.

The only other controversy I remember in 1966, was the first time I had seen an International team kick, spit and dive their way through a football match. It was Argentina. The first time ever that a player in England,( Rattin) after being shown a red card, had to be escorted off the field by the police because he refused to go. This country had never seen behaviour like it before then.

Well there's a reason why in South America the 66 World Cup (out of all of them) is seen in the same level as the inter toto.

Let me explain (and it happened too long ago to be pissed about it, but I think it's more funny/sad than for anger)

*EHEM* Lets start:

1) Quarter finals: It was i) Argentina vs. England............and ii) Uruguay vs. Germany

2) the FA and FIFA called told Argentina/Uruguay that the "draw for referees" was at (let's say) "4:00PM"

3) When Argentina/Uruguay got there, they were informed that the draw had actually taken place at "3:00 PM" and that i) Argentina/England was to be reffed by a German............and Uruguay/Germany by an English :funny: (that's more sad than funny, as said before)

4) i) Argentina/England- Ratin goes to argue a call and gets "ejected" (no red cards until 1970, and getting ejected was unheard of). England didnt need much else to win the game.
ii) Uruguay/Germany- Uruguay score 1 goal that is called offside (that wasnt) and then score again EXACTLY the same way as the "3rd goal" England/Germany final (bounced crossbar and went in).
URuguay goes to argue why the "No goal", and TWO players get ejected (refeer to my previous comment of it being unheard of that ONE get ejected.)
2 Ejected players= Game over.

5) Final Germany/England.........Ironic part was that Germany ended up getting screwed by the end with their own acomplice, hehe. talk about "DTA".

Funny part of all this is that I heard that Argentina and Uruguay arrived at the ariport at the same time and just started laughing like..."wow... you too?".

Over there it's pretty common knowledge. But I was glad that Canada showed this in the 2002 World cup on Sportsnet during the weeks prior to the WC (part of a "most controvercial moments" part of a show. Cool that they recognized it.

It's surprising that Argentina recalls that much more with anger than humour than us. (I guess, Italy wont think back about the Korea game in the future with laughter.....so I guess I understand)

*Back then Argentina wasnt the power force they were today (they were famous in South America, but not too big in the world stage)

*Uruguay, as Usual back then, was a favorite to go all the way ; having an amazing team that tied England 0-0 at Wembley, brushed off France. (Thus why the extreme measures <compared to Argentina> to get them eliminated.)

All in all, pretty interesting stuff.

 

[Lennon]

I have to disagree pasion, the biggest ripoff in WC history after the 2002 Korea fiasco was the Argentina 78 WC. Argentina beating Peru 6-0..... :boohoo:

 

[Pontiakos]

I think this time it will be the U.S. instead of Korea...... :fool:


but seriously I am looking forward to this world cup, I think it will be one of the better reffed tournaments we will have seen in a long time.

 

[Kibe Kru]

1) It didn't cross the line. The linesman didn't take any action when the "goal" was scored, yet when the ref asked him, he said it was in.
2) When the fourth was scored, there were supporters on the field. Play would have to be stopped.
3) The refs in the quarter finals... If it was an Argie reffing the Uruguay match, and an Uruguayan reffing the Argentina one, you'd be complaining about it until now.
4) Semis: England vs. Portugal set to Goodison, where Portugal had already played (and beaten) Brazil and North Korea, transferred to Wembley due to "great interest" from the supporters. Portugal wasn't asked about the venue change.

Brazilian squad official journalist, present in every cup from 30 to 66: "Never have so many referees done so much to help so few."

Did England play better and deserve to win? Probably. Were they the best team in the tournament? Probably. But the main reason they've won the final match wasn't Hurst. It was Tofik Bakhramov.

1978 Argentina was worse though...

But they're World Cup champs, and probably deservedly so. No reason to contest that now.

 

[mnj2x]

Korea worked their socks off and deserved the 4th place at the 2002 world cup...maybe with a bit of luck but u need that in footballl...so get over it.

 

[pasion1]

I have to disagree pasion, the biggest ripoff in WC history after the 2002 Korea fiasco was the Argentina 78 WC. Argentina beating Peru 6-0..... :boohoo:

oh no doubt. I agree (I never said that the 66 fiasco was the Worst, just up there)

But 78 is looked at "Better" cause Argentina atleast won the final fair and square. But yeah, that was terrible. (You could tell the Peru Goalie <who was from Argentina> was diving late in those goals (it's not hard to make it seem as if you are "Trying to dive" yet miss at the end, he'd come off his line in 1 vs. 1 plays WAY too late, and then try to save it.

 

[Rob]

There is always Italy.

 

[pasion1]

Did England play better and deserve to win? Probably. Were they the best team in the tournament? Probably.

Pretty biased there. I know you're not English, but im guessing you sympathize since you support Liverpool.
This is sort of like a Korean saying in 20 years "Were Korea Better than Italy....Probably. Are they a better at football?....Probably."

For sure many nations would be crying until today in the 66 thing. The reason Uruguay and Argentina dont is simple: We have 4 World Cups together <6 world championships in total>, which is huge (individaully with 2, which is more than 95% of the world will ever win).

There's been alot of "Screwing" in World Cup history.

That Portugual semi final, I had never heard of....but wow.

In 1970, Uruguay was made to travel an incredible amount of time to face Brazil......while the game was held where Brazil was staying. But why dont we complain THAT much? 1950 baby ....that is priceless for all time until the end of the planet's existence and then some. So 1970 isnt so bad.
(And it's going to happen again in 2014 )


But hey...you remember 1954? Hungary lost the world cup final out of exhaustion from the extra time Semi final, talk about bad luck (As they should have beaten Germany).

1986? Maradona anyone? The Brits cry about that until today
1990? Brazil- and the "Water" fiasco vs. Argentina. (That gets the "BRet HArt award" right there lol)
1994- Not really "Screw" but the Tab Ramos injury when Elbowed by the Brazilian (USA vs. Brazil) was criminal, he should have been arrested for that.
1998- Morroco didnt qualify after Norway got a very hard to call Penalty vs. Brazil in the last second.


I find this "Screwing History" pretty interesting. Anyone have any other games to add?

But I think the errors are honest. The game is too fast for Refs to not use Technology these days. FIFA said they were going to make major changes after 2006.

 

[ShiftyPowers]

I was about to hate on you completely passion, but then you posted something akin to "the USA outplayed Champions Brazil in 1994 and should have won except for crappy reffing" and so now I think you're the greatest poster on SG.

 

[Bonzi]

For sure many nations would be crying until today in the 66 thing. The reason Uruguay and Argentina dont is simple: We have 4 World Cups together <6 world championships in total>, which is huge (individaully with 2, which is more than 95% of the world will ever win).

I wouldn't equate Argentinian cups with Uruguayan ones
Argentina won their cups in the modern history of World Cups, while Uruguay won it when the system of the World Cup itself was completely different.

 

[Kibe Kru]

Well, I said probably because I've never got to see a single match from that world cup besides a few fouls on Pele vs. Portugal and the Garc.. uh... Hurst ball that counted as a goal. You can't deny they had a good side though... Banks, Bobby Moore, Carlos and Bobby Charlton, Nobby Stiles, Roger Hunt and of course Hurst.

20 years from now a kid may say Korea was better than Italy, but then I believe it'll be much easier to access the information by then (like video clips of the errors and such) than it is now, and he'll be able to see what happened.

As for screwings... (some may not be big, but still...)

Arg vs. Fra, 1930. Ref ends second half at 39 mins, and after a bit of confusion (some players had already taken a shower) 6 mins had to be played. No goals though. (Arg won 1-0)

Bra vs. Cze, 1962. Garrincha was sent off in the previous match, which would mean he'd miss the final. He was allowed to play though. Fortunately for the Czechs, he had fever on the day and barely played. Brazil still won 3-1

Bra vs. Cze, 1938. Both sides were screwed here, as they had to travel a lot. The match was held in Bordeaux, and the Czechs had to come from Le Havre (521 km). Brazil had to come from Strasbourg (758 km - 12 hours)

Bra vs. Yug, 1950. Brazil played their three previous matches in Rio and Sao Paulo (400 km between them). Yugoslavia had to play in Belo Horizonte, Porto Alegre and Rio. (BH ---1712 km ---> PA ---1553 km ---> Rio, in 7 days) Uruguay can't complain too much here. They've played in BH, then Sao Paulo (about 500 km from BH) and Rio. Also, their first "group stage" was Uruguay and Bolivia, so only one match to play before the final group stage.

Germany, 1954. This World Cup was weird. Each group had 2 seeded teams that wouldn't play each other. Germany was a top side, but as "punishment" after they had been expelled from FIFA in 1945, and rejoined in 1950, they weren't seeded, and ended up having to face Hungary in the group stage. Their 8-3 defeat is overrated though. Germany knew they had to win against Turkey (the other seeded team), and that Turkey would beat South Korea, so they rested their best players against Hungary (which would be a tough match) and then went on to beat Turkey on a playoff to decide the second qualifier from the group with fresh players.

Hard to understand, I know... I'll post the results:
Hun 9-0 Kor
Ger 4-1 Tur
Hun 8-3 Ger
Tur 7-0 Kor
Ger 7-2 Tur (Playoff)

This system also caused a funny moment when Brazil and Yugoslavia met. A draw would send them through (though extra time would have to be played.. Don't ask me why...) The match ended 1-1, and then extra time started. Brazil tried to push forward and score, with the yugoslavs trying to explain they'd be both through if the scoreline stayed the same. But the brazilians thought the yugoslavs were mocking them! Only after the match did the players got to know they were through. Some of them were already feeling sad.

Back to screwing...

Swi vs. Ita, 1954. Brazilian ref favoured the swiss, allowing rough plays that would be fouls, but whistling happily when the italians did the same. Swi ended up winning 2-1. Italy dominated, and even scored a good equalizer, ruled off for an unexistent offside position. Italy players cornered the ref Mario Vianna into the net, but the ref managed to get off by pushing and punching the players. Later, in the infamous "Battle of Bern" (Hun 4-2 Bra, quarter finals, 42 fouls) Vianna would say a lot of "bad words" to the ref of that match, and Brazil was punished by not being allowed to send refs for 58...

Also, there was a match between Colombia and the USSR, I think it was 1962. The ref was a brazilian again, and he was anti-communist. He made a player re-take a penalty three times until the soviets missed. Not sure about this one though, as I've heard it on TV some years ago, and can't really be 100% sure about the source.

Phew.. long post....

 

[Bonzi]

Also, there was a match between Colombia and the USSR, I think it was 1962. The ref was a brazilian again, and he was anti-communist. He made a player re-take a penalty three times until the soviets missed.

What a bastard!

Communism :Bow:
Capitalism

 

[pede54]

Well one things for sure, over the years just about every Nation has been cheated at one stage or another. It will always happen. This World Cup will not be any different. Legitimate goals will be disallowed and illegitimate goals will be given. Some teams will benefit from "dodgy" officials and some teams will lose out. Its a shame that the Worlds premier football competition is and always will be tainted. Fifa manipulate the results to suit themselves, that is obvious to all. They have always done that and this year will be no different.

Just going back to someones poor effort to be-little Geoff Hursts performance in the 1966 Finals. He scored a hat trick in that Final game. Thats something that nobody did before or since. That makes him a legend of the World Cup competition whether you like it or not. Germany did not lay down and give England an easy ride you know. That was probably one of the most fiercely contested finals that I have ever witnessed. Germany got plenty of unjust calls in their favour too as well as decisions against. The aforementioned handball being the most decisive one. If the ref would have given that call, the Germans would not have scored an equaliser, and the game would have been won at 2 - 1. No extra time and no controversial 3rd England goal, and no reason for the Germans to whinge about it for 40 years.

This year it will be someone elses turn to be "cheated". It might be us or it might be you. Thats the way it is. I dont think there has EVER been a World Cup winning nation that can honestly say that they didn't get help along the way from either the refs, the linesmen or Fifa.

It is interesting though to recall all the controversies, and I think it does show how consistant "manipulation" has been over the years. You would have to be pretty naive to think that the World Cup was ever won by talent alone though.