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Oceania loses direct WC place
- Thread starter Jono82
- Start date
im with my formerly convicted cousins on this one.I say that a world cup should be just that, a World Cup.Ok so OZ only have to play against 1 real oppostion, it shouldnt be a free for all(as some of you have pointed out)but it should be a fair split.As it stands and im from europe, europe has too many places.I think its only fair that Every Confederation had at least 1 representative.Football is a world sport.How can a young person in Australia/New Zealand/Oceana be encouraged to play football when he/she cant see there national team competing at the highest stage.Development will become sterile because theres nothing to aim for, no point, no need because hey , its not like im ever gonna play in the world cup because im from Australia.I would be in favour of giving away 1 of the UEFA slots.It would be nice to see a team from The SE of Earth at a world cup.Be it Australia, New Zealand, The Cook Islands ,anywhere.
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Pop Quiz-----How many European sides have won the World Cup ?...........
A......If you know...why do we need so many places for European teams ?????????????????............££££££££££££££$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$%%%%%%%%%%%%......thats why !
Well should I then cite all the other 130 or so nations that have never been to a world cup? is football is those countries gonna die? is it dead?.....is the world cup less world because every single country hasnt played it?
The COMEBOL proposed to have 36 teams so that evrybody could be represented. It was a lousy idea. I mean soon enough we'll just have a 80 teams play the final stage over a year....why not? everybody has to be included
The COMEBOL proposed to have 36 teams so that evrybody could be represented. It was a lousy idea. I mean soon enough we'll just have a 80 teams play the final stage over a year....why not? everybody has to be included
Originally posted by KingPaulV
Well should I then cite all the other 130 or so nations that have never been to a world cup? is football is those countries gonna die? is it dead?.....is the world cup less world because every single country hasnt played it?
The COMEBOL proposed to have 36 teams so that evrybody could be represented. It was a lousy idea. I mean soon enough we'll just have a 80 teams play the final stage over a year....why not? everybody has to be included
The South American 36 nation plan was to have 2 more nations from South America in addition to the original 4 (so that 6/10 - 60% of South American Nations qualify) - it sure is a fair and Equitable system!
Look, if FIFA insist on dividing up the qualifiers the way they do, and promote the WC as a showcase of global football, then they damn well better come through by making it globally representative. Australia can't help where it is located, but if FIFa wish to prohibit Oceania from having a direct spot, then why not collapse them into the Asian federation and see if that works... what is the point in having a separate Oceania federation if they aren't guranteed a place at the global showcase of football.
You are missing the point. The World Cup is meant to be representative of the global game. At the moment it is not.
You are missing the point. The World Cup is meant to be representative of the global game. At the moment it is not.
Originally posted by Jono82
The South American 36 nation plan was to have 2 more nations from South America in addition to the original 4 (so that 6/10 - 60% of South American Nations qualify) - it sure is a fair and Equitable system!
Actually the plan was the South American proposal after Oceania already had an Automatic berth. because the extra place that was given to Oceania came from the .5 that South America has.....
They asked FIFA to leave that one place to Oceania but give them two extras in return....
PaPaGeorGeo
Fan Favourite
This just shows how currupt Sporting Organisations are today. All they want is the money. Asian have been given there places because of money. The most money in Football is in Asian not how they got the extra place
Anyone who thinks that Conmebol's claims for a 36 team wc is misguided. As in now blatantly obvious, they put that plan forward so that they could give something up, and inturn be reimbursed, hence the return of the 0.5.
Additionally, this was not a plan that everyone thought was high and mighty, it was a case of political manipulation.
First of all: They had an agreement with Europe whereas UEFA would back the return of the .5 inexchange for some consessions from conmebol. These came down to playing some qualifiers with 2 in one week, thus virtually halving the amount of flights of south american players out of europe, and thus better players for european clubs. The second consession was that world cup preperation friendlies wont have the south american teams calling up their europeon players.
Second of all: they took advantage of a board running the domestic fa of aus, and the incomtence and sheer stupidity of them, and then combined this with the kiwi's lackluster performances in the confed cup and made the claim that because Australia as the powerhouse is poorly run, and because the second team is poor when playing against some of the best teams in the world, therefore oceania is undeserving of .5.
And then you arrive at Blatter, whatever way you look at the situation, he lied. Plain and simple. He PROMISED in exchange for the oceania vote to elect him, that we would be awarded the extra .5. By going back on this he has forever made himself a target of oceania's hatred. When he came over sometime ago post election he was welcomed with open arms because he was the saviour of oceania. It seems times change. What he did was the equivelance of a politician promising to fix crime if elected, bringing in police once he has won, only refusing to pay for it, and then spending the money on bribing officials to give power to himself....infact as i type this, i realise it almost exactly what has done.
This is another nail in the coffin for oceania that fifa has been crafting since the inception of the ofc, for decades oceania has been the one confederation that has not had a voice in anything, the one that is juggled around and mistreated because no one cares, if someone steps up and supports the ofc then they know that they would be inturn be losing power as it is handed over. This is the problem with football....infact it is the problem with the world. Politics are all that matters. Not a good game of football, not the pride in your nation, not anything, but political power given to the high and mighty so that they can go about their lives content that they are as self-serving as possible. But this is just fifa, conmebol or any organisations, this is especially soccer australia, with their mismanagement they have ensured that they when they are finally booted out of office, that this will be considered the lowest ever time for soccer in this country, and in this region, to quote craig foster 'soccer australia loaded the gun, fifa pulled the trigger'.
By limiting the potential for the oceanic champion to gain access to the highest tier of international football, fifa is acting not 'for the good of the game' but for the good of the bank account. Who gains money by having a well known team playing in a world cup, fifa - as the tv revenue rolls.
For anyone who thinks that oceania is underserving of direct qualification route, you are again misguided. When you watch a game of football you don't think back and say that because your team won a game 20 years ago that you are the champions of the world. You say that by winning on the day. No game from the past matters. A game of football is two teams lining up, and the winner is whoever plays the best. Not who is from the best region in the world. Not who has the most money, or the most fans, or the most success. It is who goes out and plays with the pride, for their country or club. But by removing the potential for one of the 'minnows' of oceania to get through is blasphemous to the concept of football.
Someone pointed out the case of venzuala somehow getting into the fifth spot in conmebol, and then how bad it would be to be knocked out after going so well. Well i ask you, what is the difference with tahiti, with fiji, or even American samoa the infamous 32-0 capitulators. When I think of the world cups, i don't think of the great teams, the great players. No, i think of the times when your imagination takes over, when you dream of a unheard of nation, as they play with spirit and take the world by storm. I'm talking about North Korea, Cameroon, Nigeria, South Korea. The nations who no one has known about, no one thought they could even field 11 players, let alone a team capable of taking your breath away as they do the impossible.
This is what football is about, not Real Madrid or Brazil claiming their billionth title. It is about watching a game, and dreaming of the potential, and how amazing the game could be.
And by removing direct access for oceania, fifa has all but removed that happening.
Finally, to Fifa, and Sepp Blatter, i say this - I hope your actions bring you happiness, because it brings naught but saddness, and hardship to the players and fans of oceania.
Additionally, this was not a plan that everyone thought was high and mighty, it was a case of political manipulation.
First of all: They had an agreement with Europe whereas UEFA would back the return of the .5 inexchange for some consessions from conmebol. These came down to playing some qualifiers with 2 in one week, thus virtually halving the amount of flights of south american players out of europe, and thus better players for european clubs. The second consession was that world cup preperation friendlies wont have the south american teams calling up their europeon players.
Second of all: they took advantage of a board running the domestic fa of aus, and the incomtence and sheer stupidity of them, and then combined this with the kiwi's lackluster performances in the confed cup and made the claim that because Australia as the powerhouse is poorly run, and because the second team is poor when playing against some of the best teams in the world, therefore oceania is undeserving of .5.
And then you arrive at Blatter, whatever way you look at the situation, he lied. Plain and simple. He PROMISED in exchange for the oceania vote to elect him, that we would be awarded the extra .5. By going back on this he has forever made himself a target of oceania's hatred. When he came over sometime ago post election he was welcomed with open arms because he was the saviour of oceania. It seems times change. What he did was the equivelance of a politician promising to fix crime if elected, bringing in police once he has won, only refusing to pay for it, and then spending the money on bribing officials to give power to himself....infact as i type this, i realise it almost exactly what has done.
This is another nail in the coffin for oceania that fifa has been crafting since the inception of the ofc, for decades oceania has been the one confederation that has not had a voice in anything, the one that is juggled around and mistreated because no one cares, if someone steps up and supports the ofc then they know that they would be inturn be losing power as it is handed over. This is the problem with football....infact it is the problem with the world. Politics are all that matters. Not a good game of football, not the pride in your nation, not anything, but political power given to the high and mighty so that they can go about their lives content that they are as self-serving as possible. But this is just fifa, conmebol or any organisations, this is especially soccer australia, with their mismanagement they have ensured that they when they are finally booted out of office, that this will be considered the lowest ever time for soccer in this country, and in this region, to quote craig foster 'soccer australia loaded the gun, fifa pulled the trigger'.
By limiting the potential for the oceanic champion to gain access to the highest tier of international football, fifa is acting not 'for the good of the game' but for the good of the bank account. Who gains money by having a well known team playing in a world cup, fifa - as the tv revenue rolls.
For anyone who thinks that oceania is underserving of direct qualification route, you are again misguided. When you watch a game of football you don't think back and say that because your team won a game 20 years ago that you are the champions of the world. You say that by winning on the day. No game from the past matters. A game of football is two teams lining up, and the winner is whoever plays the best. Not who is from the best region in the world. Not who has the most money, or the most fans, or the most success. It is who goes out and plays with the pride, for their country or club. But by removing the potential for one of the 'minnows' of oceania to get through is blasphemous to the concept of football.
Someone pointed out the case of venzuala somehow getting into the fifth spot in conmebol, and then how bad it would be to be knocked out after going so well. Well i ask you, what is the difference with tahiti, with fiji, or even American samoa the infamous 32-0 capitulators. When I think of the world cups, i don't think of the great teams, the great players. No, i think of the times when your imagination takes over, when you dream of a unheard of nation, as they play with spirit and take the world by storm. I'm talking about North Korea, Cameroon, Nigeria, South Korea. The nations who no one has known about, no one thought they could even field 11 players, let alone a team capable of taking your breath away as they do the impossible.
This is what football is about, not Real Madrid or Brazil claiming their billionth title. It is about watching a game, and dreaming of the potential, and how amazing the game could be.
And by removing direct access for oceania, fifa has all but removed that happening.
Finally, to Fifa, and Sepp Blatter, i say this - I hope your actions bring you happiness, because it brings naught but saddness, and hardship to the players and fans of oceania.
I will say this, and hope that for once someone will listen.
The point of the inequality of using play-offs, is that ANYTHING can happen.
I agree some nations would DREAM of having to go through 2 games to play, but thats the point SOME nations would, we don't because we are confident about the strength of oceania.
When you play league football you know at the end of the season, that the team at the top is the best team in the league.
And that is why we want to have at the least a round robin with more than two games (Possible all the .5 qualifiers play off, thus a 4 team series with 6 games). The point of having qualifiers spread throughout a home and away series over everysingle team is that best team should end up at the top, and thus qualify, whereas everytime it comes down to the wire, it isn't necessarily the best team that gets through.
If a play-off was simply a game that would always go the way of the best team, then i agree that it would be a good system. But the point is that it isn't. It means that the team with the mental hardship and experience from pro-longed qualifiers will usually win.
Hahaha, you really think that Ivory Coast, Algeria, Ghana, Zambia, Zimbabwe, Morocco, Congo etc are as good as Australia?
Well again thats where your ignorance comes into it...Recent results (friendlies are the only things that we can go by, as we never get REAL matches
): Beaten France, England, Drawn with France, won one, and lost one to Uruguay...You people still are not listenning...
Everyone looks at the nations that wouldnt/dont make it, and compares their strength...What about the nations that are making it from Asia? Im not saying Samoa etc should be in the World Cup, im saying that the BEST oceania team, is better then any asian team apart from the top 2.
danger zone
Reserve Team
You Aussies are a sad bunch. You should be happy with the route you already have, like so many have said. How about when New Zealand qualified in 1982. They played fifteen games, a then record! A bit harder than eight, six of which are a walkover. And then witness the Kiwi's group in 82, Scotland, Brazil and USSR. All powers at that time, and if you think Scotland weren't let me run some names past you: Dalglish, Archibald, Wark, Strachan, Jordan, Souness, McGrain, Robertson, Hansen, Alan Brazil, Miller etc So don't give me that unfair spiel you wankers.
That was 21 years ago!!!
In case you hadn't worked it out already, Australia has gotten ALOT better since then (whereas New Zealand has gone the other way)
If Australia (Ocenaia) doesn't deserve direct entry to the World CUp... what about England? Dont forget the 12th February!!
I wasnt JUST speaking to you, AND heaps of people have said that playing more games during qualification means that you deserve more spots...Australia would LOVE to play more than 2 tough games...We would love to be in a confederation where we get to play lots of hard games, if it meant that the top 5 teams qualified.
Which is somehting that I again dont agree with, BUT atleast the teams are in a similar situation as each other...Its not a matter playing a team whos preparation matches have been totally different...The European teams are coming from the one place..But still, a playoff isnt fair for them...Another point to consider is that, if they WON their group, theyd be straight into the Cup...Its only the runners up in each group that arent...FINALLY: you cant tell me that they have to play 10 touch matches...Since when has EVERY nation in Europe been a strong nation...Are you telling me San Marino, Liechtenstein, Luxembourg, Andorra, Malta, Kazakhstan, Georgia, Armenia etc are strong nations?
Do you? Then you must like to take chances...In a league system, the BEST team rises to the top...That is what Australia wants...doesnt the fact that we want this, show that we're confident that our team is good enough, if we had a fair system?
As I said, in one match ANYTHING can happen...
YES we've only played two good nations...BUT look at non-compeititve games (we dont get ANY other competitive games unlike Euro Champs, and Copa America)...
When it comes down to playing ONE team, Ive given evidence, and said over and over again, that ANYTHING can happen...You can deny it all that you want, but the fact remains.
Yes, either do I...But your top nation QUALIFIES, and then the 2nd placed nation get a playoff....Our top doesnt even qualify...BUT AGAIN, this isnt about the teams that we have to play, its about hte teams that are good enough to be in the finals...
AND again, Im not saying that Europe should be losing places...But can you truthfully tell me that Asia deserve 4 places more than Oceania?
I think you've missed the point..Wed LOVE to be in a league situation...Simply having a PLAYOFF doesnt work...Combine OFC and AFC, IF FIFA are willing to fork out the $$ needed for hte Oceania nations to travel to Asia...
Again, playoffs do NOT work...Rather then playing off against an asian team, take half of one of their spots, and give it to us...
There are Definitely no more then 4 asian nations that deserve to qualfiy more than Aust.
Again?
You misunderstood why I was posting that. Someone said there was 12 games in south american qualifying and I corrected them.Since you brought it up. the quality of opposition and other variables in south america (altitude, hostile countries) can't be compared between SA and oceania, group stages are far more difficult in SA then in anywhere else in the world.
As I said, I don't mind auto qualification for oceania as long as it's not at the expense of a south american country. Your real argument should be with the asian members and not the south Americans. FIFA made the right decision rewarding SA with there half spot, while the decision to give Asia such a high number of spots is questionable and undeserved. You yourself should admit to that.