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hmm..netherlands is missing
- Thread starter mnj2x
- Start date
You people are sooooo stupid, Vieri's best days are behind him????My god he had 24 goals in 21 games last year in a so called defensive league. Kluivert is a choker in big games. Ruud doesnt perform that well for Holland compared to what he does at Man Utd, Hasselbaink is definitevly not better than Inzaghi, at least Inzaghi proved last year in the CL what a good finisher he was by finishing second top scorer in the CL. Just Italy's defense destroys Holland's and Euro 2000 was no fluke, Holland barely had 1 or 2 scoring chance, the first pk was not even supposed to be a pk, the second yes, but still its not Italy's fault that Holland sucks at taking pk's.
MadAZNFootballe
Youth Team
You also gotta remember Italy was down a man for a fair amount of time.
LiberoHong
Club Supporter
Originally posted by Jomi
Be careful, too much arrogance and self confidence can lead to cruel desillusions.
Remember France in the World Cup
Even a team of that quality of France - maybe the best A national side as of now - ain't same without world's greatest; ZIZOU a la 2002 worldcup ZIZOU was missed in that piece
LiberoHong
Club Supporter
how bout a Creation center so you can make Dutch side and fix the damn jersey numbers EA messed up.
soccerbread
Club Supporter
I think that all countries no matter what should be in the game other wise we all keep having these conversations and every gets mad, if they don't get rights they should just make like a generic team at least to replace them or something.
MagicaRoma
Youth Team
My God!!!!!!!!!!!!!1You make me laugh! I am Dutch but mainly a Roma fan so I often see the likes of Totti, Cassano, Montella and co play and trust me: ITALY WOULD CRASH HOLLAND!!!
The reason why they wouldn't would be the same reason why they failed during the world-cup: a demented and too defensive minded coach like Trappatoni.
Just compare the teams:
keeper: Van de Sar- over the hill and never able to save "impossible" shots against Buffon: regarded as one (if not the best) keeper in the world.
defense: Holland has got 1 defender: Stam & he's getting old. De Boer is slow and a laugh with his mistakes & on the wings they haven't got "real" defenders, van Bronckhosrt/Reiziger are too attacking and lack skill. Italy has in Cannavaro & Nesta the 2 best and solid defenders in the world!
In midfield Italy has got ballwinners like Zanetti, Holland has got Davids & apart from that, people like Cocu who are TOO old (again, most of the Dutch team is over 30!!). On the flanks I don't think over-the-hill (again) OVermars or mediocre Van der Meijde (what a laugh, Inter, he's Bologna material, not topteam worthy as he's proving week in week out with a few exceptions) can compete with the likes of Zambrotta!
Attack: How can you call Vieri crap????? He scores EVERYWHERE! Don't see Patrick (9goals a year for Barca) Kluivert do that!
And Holland hasn't got a playmaker after Bergkamp anymore like Italy has: Totti rocks, if he's play with Cassano they'll cruise through the slow Dutch defense!!!!! Not to forget about Del Piero, Holland just doesn't have players in these positions, Seedorf comes the closest and that says it all!
And Inzaghi, Montella etc are better subs than Hasselbaink, Van Hooijdonk!
And how can you say the Dutch play good for their respectable teams? Okay, Stam, Van Nistelrooy and a couple of others maybe, but you forgot about our ****e Barca-players? And don't Italian players play good for their teams?? EVEN BETTER, WANKER!!!!
I could make it longer, but I have to go, just hope Italy will play Holland in the QFinals, and you'd be quite! Italy is WAY BEYOND HOLLAND. Inconparible, way better! Just because they beat Scotland 6-0 shouldn't let you forget the bad games they played continuously before that!!!!
Like I said, I'm Dutch, but I prefer the great Italy over those arrogant, overselfconfident and mediocre Dutch wankers! One good game (Scotland) in a year doesn't make you a champion
FORZA ITALIA & ROMA per sempre!!!!
MagicaRoma
Youth Team
Originally posted by Danimal
I underline that as a Dutchman....
I mean come on: v/d Sar, Westerveld; Reiziger, Stam, Cocu, F.de Boer, v. Bronckhorst, Zenden, Bouma, Ooijer; Seedorf, Sneijder, Davids, v. Bommel, v/d Vaart, Kluivert; v. Nistelrooy, Hasselbaink, v. Hooijdonk, Makaay, Overmars, v/d Meyde, Robben, R. de Boer:
There all worldclass. You name me one worldclass national team that has it strikers positions tripple-taken. France -no-, Italy -no-, Brazil -maybe-, England -definitley not-, Germany -Don't make me laugh-
Wait 'till Euro2004; we'll show y'all what soccer is about!!!!!
D.animal
Another one, I compare with the Italian team (which you call less than Holland):
Buffon, Toldo (does he ring a bell maybe, little spotkick boy); Nesta, Panucci, Cannavaro, Legrotaglie, Ferrari, Oddo, Maldini (if he'll still play for them), Zambrotta, Coco, Perrotta, Zanetti, Fiore, Tomassi, De Rossi (who? you'll know soon.....), Pirlo, Gattuso, Fiore, Del Piero, Camoranesi, Totti, Inzaghi, Vieri, Montella, Cassano, Di Vaio, Delvechio, Corradi
And strikerpositions triple taken, let me see:
Trequartista/playmaker: Totti-Del Piero-Cassano
Tall, target man striker: Vieri, Delvechio, Corradi
Quick, pacefull striker: Inzaghi, Montella, De Vaio
That only took me 3 seconds to think of, so I don't know where YOU get your primitive impression from that only Holland has that. Oh no, Holland DOESN'T HAVE a trequartista, only strikers, which means Italy has EVEN MORE options, as they can play in different positions!!! So don't come out with bull**** that Italy hasn't got those positions triple taken, first learn not to be so narrow minded before you open your IGNORANT mouth. And who cares if you have triple taken positions anyway, you need ONE cover-up for every position, NOT TWO (waste for the bench), plus players that are multi-functional, and Holland doesn't have the latter: eg: Totti, Del Piero & Cassano can play as playmaker AND striker, Delvechio can play striker and leftwing etc.......Kluivert, van Nistelrooy, etc can play as a striker, AND THAT's IT!
If you still think Holland is better, you are just arrogant or chauvinistic or worst: BOTH!!!!!
americangreg
Reserve Team
I must agree with that mediterranean friend of mine 
MagicaRoma
Youth Team
Were you referring to me? I don't only live in Holland (like you), but I'm born and raised here. My nationality is Dutch, no Italian blood or whatever!Originally posted by americangreg
I must agree with that mediterranean friend of mine
Maybe my opinion sounds strange as I'm Dutch myself, but if I like it or not, on my passport is still says: Netherlands!
MagicaRoma
Youth Team
[Maybe it's easier to understand my oppinion if I say that my girlfriend is born Roman!
And like Italian women compared to Dutch women, it's the same with the football teams, NO COMPARISONS!!!! Italy wins by miles
And like Italian women compared to Dutch women, it's the same with the football teams, NO COMPARISONS!!!! Italy wins by miles
Well, Mr. MagicaRoma, I'm glad I got you all riled up enough to waste your time.
Though maybe you never even read my post because I CLEARLY never said Holland would beat Italy, I'm not quite as stupid as you are to make such claims. Anything can happen on any given day. You must relise that since Italy went crashing out of the last World Cup so EASILY.
Also, I'm certain in my post I NEVER SAID that because we beat Scotland that we'd "destroy" anyone. Clearly I'm not dumb enough (unlike you) to make such claims.
The future will tell as to whether or not Holland will advance and the same will go for Italy. Though it is absolutely CERTAIN that Italy plays the most boring, pathetic, uninspiring, defensive, 10-men-behind-the-ball, wait for the other team to **** up football that has ever been played.
You can always count on that fact that if an Italian team is in any final, it will be one of the worst finals in history. Just like last years Champions League final. AC Milan?? Best team in the world?
The only team they actually beat from the quarter finals on was in the second leg against Ajax (3-2). Tied both Games against Inter and then tied Juve in the final. Typical. 0-0 How exciting!! Typical Italian football.
Kinda hard for Totti, Del Piero, Viera, or any other striker to score when they're PLAYING DEFENSE!!!
Want proof?
Euro 2000 Italy v Holland 0-0 (Italy had to win on penalties).
World Cup '98 Italy v France 0-0 (France won this time on kicks)
World Cup '94 Italy v Brazil 0-0 (Brazil won on kicks)
World Cup '90 Semifinals Italy v Argentina 1-1 after a full 120 minutes Argentina won on kicks....
I COULD go on and on but you get the idea. Maybe Italy should try and WIN one of these games instead of not losing and maybe, just maybe, they'd win in full time. It seems they don't really fare well in PK's.
Next time you just down my throat, read my post first. Don't put words in my mouth that I never said.
Though maybe you never even read my post because I CLEARLY never said Holland would beat Italy, I'm not quite as stupid as you are to make such claims. Anything can happen on any given day. You must relise that since Italy went crashing out of the last World Cup so EASILY.
Also, I'm certain in my post I NEVER SAID that because we beat Scotland that we'd "destroy" anyone. Clearly I'm not dumb enough (unlike you) to make such claims.
The future will tell as to whether or not Holland will advance and the same will go for Italy. Though it is absolutely CERTAIN that Italy plays the most boring, pathetic, uninspiring, defensive, 10-men-behind-the-ball, wait for the other team to **** up football that has ever been played.
You can always count on that fact that if an Italian team is in any final, it will be one of the worst finals in history. Just like last years Champions League final. AC Milan?? Best team in the world?
The only team they actually beat from the quarter finals on was in the second leg against Ajax (3-2). Tied both Games against Inter and then tied Juve in the final. Typical. 0-0 How exciting!! Typical Italian football.
Kinda hard for Totti, Del Piero, Viera, or any other striker to score when they're PLAYING DEFENSE!!!
Want proof?
Euro 2000 Italy v Holland 0-0 (Italy had to win on penalties).
World Cup '98 Italy v France 0-0 (France won this time on kicks)
World Cup '94 Italy v Brazil 0-0 (Brazil won on kicks)
World Cup '90 Semifinals Italy v Argentina 1-1 after a full 120 minutes Argentina won on kicks....
I COULD go on and on but you get the idea. Maybe Italy should try and WIN one of these games instead of not losing and maybe, just maybe, they'd win in full time. It seems they don't really fare well in PK's.
Next time you just down my throat, read my post first. Don't put words in my mouth that I never said.
MagicaRoma
Youth Team
I allready mentioned that Italy has a overdefensive-minded coach, almost everyone in Italy hates Trapatoni cause he played so defensively! Nowadays he luckily plays more attacking, almost always with a 4312 (tridente) or 4231 formation. So with Totti/Vieri/Del Piero or Inzaghi, not so defensive, is it! And I was talking about players, NOT about how coaches use them!
Apart from that: does Holland play so attacking? Well, if they do, it's an even bigger disgrace that 4 out of 5 games are SOOOOO dull, boring & with few rendement! I can remember Yougoslavia, Portugal and Scotland in the past 4 years & THAT'S IT (maybe I forgot 1 or 2, but that doen't make a difference).
And when you talk about all those draws, don't you forget that Ajax only won 3(!!) games in the CL!! After the first group they beat Roma & lost in Milan, apart from that they managed to get 6 draws!!! I think you were not complaining about boring football than!!!!!
And CL-football IS almost always dull, as the teams are so equal. The final was boring, but so many finals are! "til that point Juve & Milan played really nice and attacking football, remember their respectable games against Madrid eg.
From the Italian teams, it was only Inter that played really disgracefull defensive football!!!
And more about clubfootball: last 2 seasons there were averagely 0,7(!!) goals per game MORE in serie A than in the Premierleague (2,9 in Serie A against 2,2 in PL), so is Italy really more boring than other leagues? Maybe stronger and more tactical, so if you don't like that kind of football it's a matter of taste, not of being more/less boring!
So your 0-0 theory doen't seem to be true as there are FAR more goals in serie A than in premiership! Just a PREJUDICE, not based on FACTS!
And national teams, why the hell do you give me the draws per tournament, you could do that with almost every team, as they'll all won't win ALL their games (exceptions there!!!).
You want prove?
EURO 92: Holland-Denmark 2-2 (Denmark wins on penalties)
EURO 96: Holland-France 0-0 (France wins on penalties)
WC 98: Holland-Brazil 1-1 (Brazil wins on penalties)
EURO 2000: Italy-Holland 0-0 (Italy wins on penalties)
WC 02: (together with WC 94) the only tournament where Holand didn't draw a single game & we all know the reason why!!
Only in the Denmark-game did Holland score more than 1 goal, and it took a last-minute Rijkaard-goal to do that, if I'm not mistaken!!
Not so different than Italy, I think, so your "prove" is kind of feeble!
I agree with you that anything can happen though, as all teams are pretty equal & there are no "easy" games anymore, but Italy looks the stronger, with the right coach/tactics they should beat Holland. ANd if I were you, I wouldn't say about Italy that "should try to win instead of trying not to loose", cause Holland doesn't seem to be too confident on penalties so they should surely try to WIN themselves in normal time!
coolhooligan
Club Supporter
Holland has more attacking flair and prowess when going forward. They don't really have quality players in the backline except for Stam who I think is really class but then again hes getting old.
Italy has creative players like Totti, Del Piero, Cassano to support the powerful out-and-out strikers like Vieri. However Italy has class defenders in Nesta and Cannavaro, Zambrotta and others. So since their defense is objectively stronger then their offense, they therefore play to their strengths which is clever.
Nowadays in high-quality matches between top teams the gap is relatively small so usually goals will be at a premium. Thats the way it is. The rest of the so-called smaller countries have caught up and lessened the gap too.
Italy has creative players like Totti, Del Piero, Cassano to support the powerful out-and-out strikers like Vieri. However Italy has class defenders in Nesta and Cannavaro, Zambrotta and others. So since their defense is objectively stronger then their offense, they therefore play to their strengths which is clever.
Nowadays in high-quality matches between top teams the gap is relatively small so usually goals will be at a premium. Thats the way it is. The rest of the so-called smaller countries have caught up and lessened the gap too.
My advice to all Holland vs. Italy arguing types is to try actually going and playing in those countries, rather than writing about it.
I have played in the UK, Holland and Italy and Italy has BY FAR the most talented player base in the world other than Brazil (even their embassy team of mostly ex race car drivers and polo players beat the heck out of us). It's not normal to see so many incredibly talented players in a European country, with superlative, ridiculous skills, in one country.
It's a fact. The problems with Italy are the politics behind the selections and the team strategy - if Capello was the national manager, you would see amazing changes in Italy's game - and the fact that few Italians understand the importance of team play over individual showmanship. I've seen many a hissy fit thrown because Tizio chose to shoot instead of pass...19 out of 20 times!
By the way, you should also know that in order to get a tryout in Italy for a club (as an Italian), you need a "raccomandazione".
That means your dad needs to know someone important who can make a phone call. Even in a non-meritocracy, look at the players it produces.
Holland...well, someone should have put 2 and 2 together by now and realized that if their national team is too up its own arse to give its OK to licence its brand, then imagine why the Dutch players aren't so psyched about playing.
Then again, one only needs to remember WW2 to get an idea of how paltry Dutch nationalism actually is...
But I love Amsterdam. Long live the Dutch and their...um...boutiques.
I have played in the UK, Holland and Italy and Italy has BY FAR the most talented player base in the world other than Brazil (even their embassy team of mostly ex race car drivers and polo players beat the heck out of us). It's not normal to see so many incredibly talented players in a European country, with superlative, ridiculous skills, in one country.
It's a fact. The problems with Italy are the politics behind the selections and the team strategy - if Capello was the national manager, you would see amazing changes in Italy's game - and the fact that few Italians understand the importance of team play over individual showmanship. I've seen many a hissy fit thrown because Tizio chose to shoot instead of pass...19 out of 20 times!
By the way, you should also know that in order to get a tryout in Italy for a club (as an Italian), you need a "raccomandazione".
That means your dad needs to know someone important who can make a phone call. Even in a non-meritocracy, look at the players it produces.
Holland...well, someone should have put 2 and 2 together by now and realized that if their national team is too up its own arse to give its OK to licence its brand, then imagine why the Dutch players aren't so psyched about playing.
Then again, one only needs to remember WW2 to get an idea of how paltry Dutch nationalism actually is...
But I love Amsterdam. Long live the Dutch and their...um...boutiques.