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Manchester United Thread [2004-2005]
- Thread starter shokz
- Start date
- Status
manutd4eva
Fan Favourite
Originally posted by shokz
RedCafe=
RedIssue=
RedCafe = Decent discussion.
RedIssue = Just garbage.
houston3721
Senior Squad
yes....we dont have a freekick expert who gives the opponents fear. Scholes's rocket freekicks are nice but we always do that too obviously, say, Keane stands on the left side of the ball and everyone knows that he is going to give a short push to the ball and let Scholes to fire it. Our freekicks cant be converted to goals easily, so we gotta do something on freekick tactic.
manutd4eva
Fan Favourite
How United Can Conquer Europe
Article by The Editor on March 10, 2005 06:00 PM
So United have failed in Europe for the fifth successive season. What the feck has gone wrong? Is is tactics, personnel, the manager or just plain bad luck? All of the above but just for you Rant's loyal readers we'll let you in on a secret; we've got a realistic plan for fixing the problem. There's no blue-sky thinking here' It's costed out, realistic and Fergie should put it into action right now!
1) Trim The Squad
Currently United have nearly 40 professionals on the books. Many will never make it as professionals, some are barely on the fringes of the first team and others are so bad they deserve shooting. The squad needs to be trimmed down. More is less and it'll free up cash for new purchases. Those to go should include:
Mikhael Silvestre, £8m, Juventus
John O'Shea, £4m, Newcastle
Phil Neville, £3m, Blackburn
Kléberson, £2m, Corinthians
Miller, £500k, Celtic
Bellion, £500k, for the love of God, please, anyone:funny:
Roy Carroll, out of contract
Ricardo, out of contract
Stewart, free, Hearts
Nardiello, released
Bardsley, released
Mark (M), release
Cooper, released
Johnson, released
Tierney, released
Rant calculates that this would bring is around £18m in revenue and save more than £9m per season in wages.
2) Sack Maritn Ferguson
Sacking SAF's brother may be hard on the top man but it has to be done. Ferguson junior has been responsible for Forlan, Bellion, Djemba-Djemba and Klebérson. More than sacking Ferguson, United need to overhaul their scouting network. Although they picked up gems in Piqué and Rossi in the summer, most of the younger talent has been heading to Highbury in recent times. This must end.
3) Hire A Professional Negotiator
Let's face it, United suck at negotiating. We always pay over the odds for players (Forlan, Veron, Saha) and then manage to cock-up the deals we really want (Ronaldinho). Remove this ability from the board and hand it over to an experienced negotiator who has a strict budget per player. This will stop clubs playing hardball with United and allow costs to be kept under control.
4) Bring in Selected Reinforcements
United don't need to bring in ten new players but we do need top quality. Rant's list is realistic and affordable given the money likely to be available (and it's not zero as the tabloids continue to claim):
Sebastian Frey, Goalkeeper, Parma, £5m, £40k per week
The French 'keeper is in the very top class, has a good presence about him and will certainly move this summer. Alongside Tim Howard, who Rant thinks should be given another season at the club, he will offer stability in a crucial position.
Michael Essien, Midfield, Lyon, £15m, £40k per week
The powerhouse midfielder is the ideal long-term replacement for Roy Keane. While target number one, Steven Gerrard, is almost certainly moving to Chelsea Essien represents a pragmatic option. Talented on the ball but ferocious in the tackle - this guy takes no **** and looks the perfect 'United' player.
Edu, Midfield, Arsenal, free, £60k per week
Edu has talent in abundance and would fit very neatly into the left side of United's three-man midfield (of which more later). Let's face it, he's better than his compatriot Kléberson and wouldn't cost a penny. Fergie is a known admirer and given that Edu's transfer to Valencia is on the brink of collapse a window of opportunity is available for United to pounce.
Robert Kovac or Sammy Kuaffor, Defender, Bayern Munich, both free, £35k per week
Kovac is an excellent no-nonsense European-style defender and available on a Bosman to boot. With Rant releasing Old Easter Island Head for a tidy sum, Kovac would compete with Brown for a place alongside Ferdinand at the back. Kuaffor is different - pacy and more naturally talented and, crucially, he's also younger than his team-mate.
5) Promote Youth
Guiseppe Rossi, Gerard Piqué, Jonathan Spector, David Jones, Kieron Richardson and Chris Eagles need games if they are to develop into the top players that each of them could become.
6) Use Tactics That Suit The Team
Let's pick a set of tactics that can be used home and away, in the Premiership and Europe and then bloody stick to them! While many fans crave a traditional 4-4-2 this is unlikely to succeed in the UCL. However, a variation on 4-3-3 that has served United well in the second half of the season will. The back four would comprise of four from Gary Neville, Ferdinand, Brown, Kovac/Kuaffor, Heinze and Spector. In midfield Fletcher, Keane, Essien, Scholes, Edu and Fotune would be competing for three places. Similarly, up front Rooney, van Nistelrooy, Smith, Saha, Giggs and Ronaldo would also compete for three spaces. Youth teamers would pad the squad out.
7) Rant's First Team Squad
Goalkeepers
Tim Howard
Sebastian Frey
Defenders
Gary Neville
Gabriel Heinze
Robert Kovac or Sammuel Kuaffor
Rio Ferdinand
Wesley Brown
Gerard Piqué Bernabeu
Jonathan Spector
Midfielders
Michael Essien
Edu
Roy Keane (Capt)
Paul Scholes
Chris Eagles
Kieron Richardson
Darren Fletcher
Quinton Fortune
Forwards
Cristiano Ronaldo
Wayne Rooney
Louis Saha
Ruud Van Nistlerooy
Ryan Giggs
Alan Smith
Giuseppe Rossi
Ole Gunnar Solskjaer
http://www.unitedrant.co.uk/archives/2005/03/how_united_can_1.html
-----------------
I agree with most of that.
Article by The Editor on March 10, 2005 06:00 PM
So United have failed in Europe for the fifth successive season. What the feck has gone wrong? Is is tactics, personnel, the manager or just plain bad luck? All of the above but just for you Rant's loyal readers we'll let you in on a secret; we've got a realistic plan for fixing the problem. There's no blue-sky thinking here' It's costed out, realistic and Fergie should put it into action right now!
1) Trim The Squad
Currently United have nearly 40 professionals on the books. Many will never make it as professionals, some are barely on the fringes of the first team and others are so bad they deserve shooting. The squad needs to be trimmed down. More is less and it'll free up cash for new purchases. Those to go should include:
Mikhael Silvestre, £8m, Juventus
John O'Shea, £4m, Newcastle
Phil Neville, £3m, Blackburn
Kléberson, £2m, Corinthians
Miller, £500k, Celtic
Bellion, £500k, for the love of God, please, anyone:funny:
Roy Carroll, out of contract
Ricardo, out of contract
Stewart, free, Hearts
Nardiello, released
Bardsley, released
Mark (M), release
Cooper, released
Johnson, released
Tierney, released
Rant calculates that this would bring is around £18m in revenue and save more than £9m per season in wages.
2) Sack Maritn Ferguson
Sacking SAF's brother may be hard on the top man but it has to be done. Ferguson junior has been responsible for Forlan, Bellion, Djemba-Djemba and Klebérson. More than sacking Ferguson, United need to overhaul their scouting network. Although they picked up gems in Piqué and Rossi in the summer, most of the younger talent has been heading to Highbury in recent times. This must end.
3) Hire A Professional Negotiator
Let's face it, United suck at negotiating. We always pay over the odds for players (Forlan, Veron, Saha) and then manage to cock-up the deals we really want (Ronaldinho). Remove this ability from the board and hand it over to an experienced negotiator who has a strict budget per player. This will stop clubs playing hardball with United and allow costs to be kept under control.
4) Bring in Selected Reinforcements
United don't need to bring in ten new players but we do need top quality. Rant's list is realistic and affordable given the money likely to be available (and it's not zero as the tabloids continue to claim):
Sebastian Frey, Goalkeeper, Parma, £5m, £40k per week
The French 'keeper is in the very top class, has a good presence about him and will certainly move this summer. Alongside Tim Howard, who Rant thinks should be given another season at the club, he will offer stability in a crucial position.
Michael Essien, Midfield, Lyon, £15m, £40k per week
The powerhouse midfielder is the ideal long-term replacement for Roy Keane. While target number one, Steven Gerrard, is almost certainly moving to Chelsea Essien represents a pragmatic option. Talented on the ball but ferocious in the tackle - this guy takes no **** and looks the perfect 'United' player.
Edu, Midfield, Arsenal, free, £60k per week
Edu has talent in abundance and would fit very neatly into the left side of United's three-man midfield (of which more later). Let's face it, he's better than his compatriot Kléberson and wouldn't cost a penny. Fergie is a known admirer and given that Edu's transfer to Valencia is on the brink of collapse a window of opportunity is available for United to pounce.
Robert Kovac or Sammy Kuaffor, Defender, Bayern Munich, both free, £35k per week
Kovac is an excellent no-nonsense European-style defender and available on a Bosman to boot. With Rant releasing Old Easter Island Head for a tidy sum, Kovac would compete with Brown for a place alongside Ferdinand at the back. Kuaffor is different - pacy and more naturally talented and, crucially, he's also younger than his team-mate.
5) Promote Youth
Guiseppe Rossi, Gerard Piqué, Jonathan Spector, David Jones, Kieron Richardson and Chris Eagles need games if they are to develop into the top players that each of them could become.
6) Use Tactics That Suit The Team
Let's pick a set of tactics that can be used home and away, in the Premiership and Europe and then bloody stick to them! While many fans crave a traditional 4-4-2 this is unlikely to succeed in the UCL. However, a variation on 4-3-3 that has served United well in the second half of the season will. The back four would comprise of four from Gary Neville, Ferdinand, Brown, Kovac/Kuaffor, Heinze and Spector. In midfield Fletcher, Keane, Essien, Scholes, Edu and Fotune would be competing for three places. Similarly, up front Rooney, van Nistelrooy, Smith, Saha, Giggs and Ronaldo would also compete for three spaces. Youth teamers would pad the squad out.
7) Rant's First Team Squad
Goalkeepers
Tim Howard
Sebastian Frey
Defenders
Gary Neville
Gabriel Heinze
Robert Kovac or Sammuel Kuaffor
Rio Ferdinand
Wesley Brown
Gerard Piqué Bernabeu
Jonathan Spector
Midfielders
Michael Essien
Edu
Roy Keane (Capt)
Paul Scholes
Chris Eagles
Kieron Richardson
Darren Fletcher
Quinton Fortune
Forwards
Cristiano Ronaldo
Wayne Rooney
Louis Saha
Ruud Van Nistlerooy
Ryan Giggs
Alan Smith
Giuseppe Rossi
Ole Gunnar Solskjaer
http://www.unitedrant.co.uk/archives/2005/03/how_united_can_1.html
-----------------
I agree with most of that.
ericstarkid
Reserve Team
i agree with it too
Ferguson faces another failure as United stay second best
The Guardian
If Manchester United operated by the same principles as clubs in Italy and Spain, or even those of the modern-day Chelsea, Sir Alex Ferguson would almost certainly be summoned at the end of the season and politely informed he was being ushered into retirement. That his side have twice beaten Arsenal this season and occasionally produced enthralling football would be irrelevant. Not even winning the FA Cup would guarantee saving him.
Article continues
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--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
To many, that might sound preposterous but, football being the impatient business it is, which of the top clubs in Serie A or La Liga would stick by a manager who has missed out on the Champions League quarter-finals in successive seasons? Or, put another way, which of United's associates in the elite G14 group would accept a record of only one success at a knockout stage in the European Cup since 1999?
Anybody dancing on Ferguson's grave should always make sure the coffin lid is firmly nailed down and Sky was certainly risking one of his intermittent bans by conducting a vox pop yesterday asking whether United's manager has passed his shelf-life.
United's fans usually take pride in being one of the few sets of supporters in the country who never turn on their own club. Not in public, anyway. Since Tuesday's defeat against Milan, internet chatrooms have seen Ferguson derided for his methods and transfer policies. Interestingly, however, the Ferguson who often gets the worst abuse is Martin, the manager's brother and United's chief scout. In other words, the man responsible for finding Eric Djemba-Djemba, David Bellion and Diego Forlán.
Criticisms of the manager were generally limited to the odd rant, such as: "Cringeworthy, shocking, predictable, sterile, bland and boring - thanks for everything but please go." But mainly supporters seem to be confident Ferguson is building an improving team, albeit one eight points behind Chelsea in the Premiership.
Few will take up the odds of one bookmaker offering 100-30 against Ferguson being in charge at the start of next season, with Martin O'Neill favourite to succeed him at 5-2. Yet even Ferguson's most ardent sympathisers would have to acknowledge his team is basically flawed and that, contrary to his post-Milan analysis, it may need more than just fine-tuning before they are capable of winning the European Cup again.
Everyone knows Ferguson will concentrate this summer on recruiting a new goalkeeper so United, post-Schmeichel, are no longer in the ludicrous situation where the position goes to whoever makes the least high-profile mistakes.
There are other concerns. At San Siro, Wayne Rooney and Cristiano Ronaldo looked as bewildered as tourists trying to negotiate one of Milan's zebra crossings. Ferguson spoke about them not fully adjusting to this level until 2008, but that will not placate anyone. Roy Keane, Ryan Giggs, Paul Scholes will all be gone by then, and possibly Gary Neville too.
Replacements will have to be located. Yet Ferguson has already spent next year's transfer budget on Rooney. So do United take a deep breath and delve into their 2006-07 kitty or does Ferguson join Sam Allardyce in searching for free transfers?
Keane, apparently destined never to play in a European Cup final, looked the most crestfallen player on the flight home. "We could have done better and we are out," he said. "We all have to look at ourselves. Going out in the last 16 is no good to anybody, is it? The expectations here are so high; and the manager, staff and players know that."
Keane does not go in for clichéd claptrap and needs no reminding that United's supposedly indomitable spirit is in danger of becoming the stuff of myth. It was evident in 1999 but since then it is difficult to state a case for them being unlucky in any of their eliminations.
"We aren't far away," argued Ruud van Nistelrooy, who was so rusty Ferguson should surely have played Alan Smith. "We have a younger side than Milan and their experience was an advantage to them. In the decisive moments it showed."
Ferguson has emphasised United "have no divine right" to win trophies but for a club with United's bloated resources people are entitled to more than excuses. The question is: when do they stop saying "next year"?
The Guardian
If Manchester United operated by the same principles as clubs in Italy and Spain, or even those of the modern-day Chelsea, Sir Alex Ferguson would almost certainly be summoned at the end of the season and politely informed he was being ushered into retirement. That his side have twice beaten Arsenal this season and occasionally produced enthralling football would be irrelevant. Not even winning the FA Cup would guarantee saving him.
Article continues
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
To many, that might sound preposterous but, football being the impatient business it is, which of the top clubs in Serie A or La Liga would stick by a manager who has missed out on the Champions League quarter-finals in successive seasons? Or, put another way, which of United's associates in the elite G14 group would accept a record of only one success at a knockout stage in the European Cup since 1999?
Anybody dancing on Ferguson's grave should always make sure the coffin lid is firmly nailed down and Sky was certainly risking one of his intermittent bans by conducting a vox pop yesterday asking whether United's manager has passed his shelf-life.
United's fans usually take pride in being one of the few sets of supporters in the country who never turn on their own club. Not in public, anyway. Since Tuesday's defeat against Milan, internet chatrooms have seen Ferguson derided for his methods and transfer policies. Interestingly, however, the Ferguson who often gets the worst abuse is Martin, the manager's brother and United's chief scout. In other words, the man responsible for finding Eric Djemba-Djemba, David Bellion and Diego Forlán.
Criticisms of the manager were generally limited to the odd rant, such as: "Cringeworthy, shocking, predictable, sterile, bland and boring - thanks for everything but please go." But mainly supporters seem to be confident Ferguson is building an improving team, albeit one eight points behind Chelsea in the Premiership.
Few will take up the odds of one bookmaker offering 100-30 against Ferguson being in charge at the start of next season, with Martin O'Neill favourite to succeed him at 5-2. Yet even Ferguson's most ardent sympathisers would have to acknowledge his team is basically flawed and that, contrary to his post-Milan analysis, it may need more than just fine-tuning before they are capable of winning the European Cup again.
Everyone knows Ferguson will concentrate this summer on recruiting a new goalkeeper so United, post-Schmeichel, are no longer in the ludicrous situation where the position goes to whoever makes the least high-profile mistakes.
There are other concerns. At San Siro, Wayne Rooney and Cristiano Ronaldo looked as bewildered as tourists trying to negotiate one of Milan's zebra crossings. Ferguson spoke about them not fully adjusting to this level until 2008, but that will not placate anyone. Roy Keane, Ryan Giggs, Paul Scholes will all be gone by then, and possibly Gary Neville too.
Replacements will have to be located. Yet Ferguson has already spent next year's transfer budget on Rooney. So do United take a deep breath and delve into their 2006-07 kitty or does Ferguson join Sam Allardyce in searching for free transfers?
Keane, apparently destined never to play in a European Cup final, looked the most crestfallen player on the flight home. "We could have done better and we are out," he said. "We all have to look at ourselves. Going out in the last 16 is no good to anybody, is it? The expectations here are so high; and the manager, staff and players know that."
Keane does not go in for clichéd claptrap and needs no reminding that United's supposedly indomitable spirit is in danger of becoming the stuff of myth. It was evident in 1999 but since then it is difficult to state a case for them being unlucky in any of their eliminations.
"We aren't far away," argued Ruud van Nistelrooy, who was so rusty Ferguson should surely have played Alan Smith. "We have a younger side than Milan and their experience was an advantage to them. In the decisive moments it showed."
Ferguson has emphasised United "have no divine right" to win trophies but for a club with United's bloated resources people are entitled to more than excuses. The question is: when do they stop saying "next year"?
Originally posted by Kulixs
Hm claims they shoulda have played Alan Smith in front of Ruud in that article are dumb, hes been injured for a while and is probably rusty aswell, and constantly changing manager can damage a club, look at Real's constant change of manager and whats happened to them.
That's true!!
I agree with the rant article, Kuffour would be perfect alongside Ferdinand. And the negotiater thing is also true, we have had so many chances to bring in top players, but messed it up. Somehow I've gotten the feeling that a deal with Essien will be messed up. And bringing in youngsters would refresh the team and the squad will also be fitter (less injuries or resting). And the tactics that is absolutely true, stick to one line-up, week in week out play with the same 11 en the rest should try and compete for their places, that would make the team's passing easier and faster, cause they are used to playing with eachother, only replace a player if he is injured or has personal probs etc.
Some real good news on Red Issue courtesy of REDEYE(in the know).
http://217.151.110.45/ri_forum/showthread.php?t=22912
agree that article as well. we need to sell some players. get some players that really really suit our squad (not some backup players like bellion, miller......) keep the same tactic, make some adjust when it really need. play with the same line-up. stop oftenly rotating players.
agree to you houston. our set pieces became crap since beckham left. is it we too rely on beckham when he was here? or we just don't have other good set piece tacker? giggs? he score the only free kick when we against bolton since beckham left until now, he didn't score any more. ronaldo? uhh...this guy just need some luck to stop him keep hiting post. scholes? when he step up for free kick, everyone know what he going to do.
agree to you houston. our set pieces became crap since beckham left. is it we too rely on beckham when he was here? or we just don't have other good set piece tacker? giggs? he score the only free kick when we against bolton since beckham left until now, he didn't score any more. ronaldo? uhh...this guy just need some luck to stop him keep hiting post. scholes? when he step up for free kick, everyone know what he going to do.
ericstarkid
Reserve Team
for your information, rooney and saha scored one freekick each in their debuts
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