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Oceania loses direct WC place
- Thread starter Jono82
- Start date
Actually, whilst I agree thh Oceanic winners should go into some sort of play-off with Asians teams, in a way, I think we can look at New Zealands poor performance as being the main reason why Oceania does not merit an automatic place.
It is the very fact that Oceania's 2nd best team is really pretty poor and the rest are far worse - the Oceanic section is just far too small and uncompetitive to merit an automatic spot. It is not the quality of the current Australian team that is the problem, it is the accident of geography that has them in a woefully poor confederation that is their problem.
It's bad luck on Australia just as it's bad luck on nations like Venezuela and Iceland that by accidents of geography, they are in very strong confederation and so have very little chance of ever qualifying.
It is the very fact that Oceania's 2nd best team is really pretty poor and the rest are far worse - the Oceanic section is just far too small and uncompetitive to merit an automatic spot. It is not the quality of the current Australian team that is the problem, it is the accident of geography that has them in a woefully poor confederation that is their problem.
It's bad luck on Australia just as it's bad luck on nations like Venezuela and Iceland that by accidents of geography, they are in very strong confederation and so have very little chance of ever qualifying.
Sure.
Basically I think it is ridiculous that a team that gets beaten 9-0 is included ahead of the top team from Oceania. The World Cup is meant to be a showcase of gloabal football. Fifa divides the world into geographic regions, therefore every region should be represented. That would make it a truly WORLD cup. All I am saying is that Australia would have competed better than Saudi Arabia did, yet the current rules mean Saudi get there ahead of Australia. ANd the only reason this happens is that Oceania do not get direct entry.
And if it was a pure case of showcasing global football, then we'd have exactly the same amount of teams from each continent, which, obviously, we don't!
The point is not to showcase global football; that's a reason for a WC, granted, but definitely not the purpose. This is the World Cup, where the new World Champion will be found. Teams go there to win it. That has to be their goal, or else they mght as well have stayed home.
Now the Confederations Cup, where a team from each continent is invited, that's clearly a showcase for global football.
Like I said, I'd rather see good teams playing in a WC than making it an opportunity to find out how many good teams does Oceania really have.
In my view, though, FIFA tries to make a bit of both: having the best teams from a bit all over playing together, which is okay. A compromise, possibly the best solution out there.
About inviting the best 32 teams on FIFA's ranking to play the WC.
A ranking is always pretty subjective, as we can easily find out by reading these boards once a new club ranking comes out. To make things more fair, FIFA created the qualifyings. The road to the tournament has to be hard, to ensure the best teams have plenty of time to prove they're the best indeed. If a Bulgaria makes it to the WC, then you bet your ass they deserve to be there, bcs they had to beat quality opposition. Now I know my Oceania friends really like football and definitely want to be on the next WC, which is fantastic - the game is growing worldwide indeed.
To be honest, I'd rather see Australia in Germany 2006 than China, but I think you must EARN your place, like everybody else, no exceptions made. It's a tough road for everybody, guys, but yours wouldn't be if you had that automatic spot and you all know it.Come on, guys, stop whinning and go practise some skills outside. That's how one should get a ticket to the World Cup - because you have the value to be there, and not because you got the favours of the FIFA desk officials.
Originally posted by INFESTA
Come on, guys, stop whinning and go practise some skills outside. That's how one should get a ticket to the World Cup - because you have the value to be there, and not because you got the favours of the FIFA desk officials.
No... that's South America's job! and you know it!
Originally posted by INFESTA
And if it was a pure case of showcasing global football, then we'd have exactly the same amount of teams from each continent, which, obviously, we don't!
The point is not to showcase global football; that's a reason for a WC, granted, but definitely not the purpose. This is the World Cup, where the new World Champion will be found. Teams go there to win it. That has to be their goal, or else they mght as well have stayed home.
Now the Confederations Cup, where a team from each continent is invited, that's clearly a showcase for global football.
Like I said, I'd rather see good teams playing in a WC than making it an opportunity to find out how many good teams does Oceania really have.
In my view, though, FIFA tries to make a bit of both: having the best teams from a bit all over playing together, which is okay. A compromise, possibly the best solution out there.
About inviting the best 32 teams on FIFA's ranking to play the WC.
A ranking is always pretty subjective, as we can easily find out by reading these boards once a new club ranking comes out. To make things more fair, FIFA created the qualifyings. The road to the tournament has to be hard, to ensure the best teams have plenty of time to prove they're the best indeed. If a Bulgaria makes it to the WC, then you bet your ass they deserve to be there, bcs they had to beat quality opposition. Now I know my Oceania friends really like football and definitely want to be on the next WC, which is fantastic - the game is growing worldwide indeed.
Come on, guys, stop whinning and go practise some skills outside. That's how one should get a ticket to the World Cup - because you have the value to be there, and not because you got the favours of the FIFA desk officials.
I disagree
There are multiple levels to this issue.
At the most superficial level, there is the issue of a promise. Really, this is the football equivalent of a government going back on its promise - if that happens in politics, it is called lying, and that is what Blatter has done. By supporting this move, to take away the direct qualification for Oceania, then by default you are accepting that Blatter has lied, and going along with it. Whether or not Oceania deserves direct qualification, at the very least it would be nice to see some sort of solidarity over the issue of Blatter lying. Yet most quickly jump onto the issue of Oceania and whether they deserve qualification, leaving the issue of Blatter and his lies behind.
As for the purpose of the World Cup being a means of finding the best in the world. Well, I simply cannot see hoiw a cup format is the means of finding the best team in the world: that can only happen over a sustained period of time, through a league format. Arsenal won the FA Cup last year, but they are not considered the best team in England. AC Milan won the Champions League, but do we really believe they are the best team in Europe? The fact remains that it is meant to be a WORLD cup, not a "World Cup minus Oceania". FIFA divide the world into geographic regions, and therefore I believe that if we are to follow that logic, then ALL confederations deserve a place. If FIFA are serious about expanding the scope of football, then as much as some might like to deny it, that must include Oceania. To carry on about Asia being populous etc., well that means that the task of expanding football should occur where inroads can be made the most: Oceania. Can anyone seriously see Football challenging cricket in the subcontinent? No way. Yet football WAS and CAN make large inroads in Oceania - but that task has been halted with this decision.
As for the issue of teams in Oceania having to 'earn' a place rather than getting it 'handed' to them: The fact remains that it is much easier for a national team to be organised in Europe than it is in for example Australia. To play the qualifiers means that players must be hauled from the other side of the world, not across a land border or across the channel. That is no easy task, so I can't see it as an issue of Australia being 'handed' a place. Australia also misses out on playing significant numbers of friendlies against quality opposition as a result, and this is something that needs to be taken into account. How would the Portugese team fare if their players were asked to travel from Australia or New Zealand to play their qualifiers? 24 hour flights and all that, would surely take their toll.
But anyway, we still are left with the issue of Blatter lying, and that is what really sticks in the throats of people down here. He secured Oceanias vote with a lie, and I can only hope we have a direct hand in his removal when the time comes.
And taking half a place away from Asia is not going to have a great effect on the outcome of the world cup, so I can't see why that couldn't have happened anyway.
It is happening over a sustained period of time. Namely the qualifiers comprising two to three years and culminating in the world cup finals to be played in Germany
______
And please stop complaining about South America. The fact is that COMEBOL has the hardest qualifiers with the highest quality of football, the winningiest confederation and to take a spot away from them is an injustice. The current system would be perfect except for the .5 spot that Asia does not deserve and should be given to Oceania in any case
Isac Costa
Youth Team
Perhaps I won't be heard, but I think I should leave a message here. No matter how many berths they offer to Asia and Oceania, the nations from these countries will need a little more time to play more than "supporting roles" in the World Cup finals. Just take a look at the relevance of football over there and the poor results (even if increasing) in the last years.
And ignore Korea's manipulated 4th place last year, please. Nothing personal, just mad at how Spain was stolen.
One thing that I really don't understand is 5 berths for Africa. If I am not wrong, they never qualified a team to the semifinals of any World Cup. They can bring good players into the spotlight, but never proved to be capable of developing a challenging national team, except for maybe that Milla's-inspired Cameroonian team.
And come on, 14 berths for Europe? I'd like to go back to those good days when only the best 16 national teams where on the field and the games were really competitive.
But the more countries to play the more money to make, isn't it?
And ignore Korea's manipulated 4th place last year, please. Nothing personal, just mad at how Spain was stolen.
One thing that I really don't understand is 5 berths for Africa. If I am not wrong, they never qualified a team to the semifinals of any World Cup. They can bring good players into the spotlight, but never proved to be capable of developing a challenging national team, except for maybe that Milla's-inspired Cameroonian team.
And come on, 14 berths for Europe? I'd like to go back to those good days when only the best 16 national teams where on the field and the games were really competitive.
But the more countries to play the more money to make, isn't it?
The fact of the matter is we were played by the playa you like to call :drevil: Mr Blatter :drevil:
Can you imagine Mr Blatter getting away with this if it was UEFA who got lied to? Hell No, but the fact of the matter is Oceania is just another soccer ball getting kicked around.
Also this pretty much brings the death to Soccer Australia, asuming we got through to the World Cup, it meant 20 million dollars in sponsership money to Soccer Australia who was in need of it, now with the chances of that money pretty much gone, where's the governing body going to get its net cash injection from?
The Government? Hell no, there to busy funding wars in other countries.
Let me put it to you simply.
The Case of the Average Aussie Fan
1. We were lied to, after giving our region's vote. It's not that we have a 0.5 spot now, its that fact, we were PROMISED that full spot, and in an instant, an evil man took it away from us.
2. We needed thet money from sponsers who were willing to cash up because of the spot, just to stay afloat
For the good of the game? Pffft.
Can you imagine Mr Blatter getting away with this if it was UEFA who got lied to? Hell No, but the fact of the matter is Oceania is just another soccer ball getting kicked around.
Also this pretty much brings the death to Soccer Australia, asuming we got through to the World Cup, it meant 20 million dollars in sponsership money to Soccer Australia who was in need of it, now with the chances of that money pretty much gone, where's the governing body going to get its net cash injection from?
The Government? Hell no, there to busy funding wars in other countries.
Let me put it to you simply.
The Case of the Average Aussie Fan
1. We were lied to, after giving our region's vote. It's not that we have a 0.5 spot now, its that fact, we were PROMISED that full spot, and in an instant, an evil man took it away from us.
2. We needed thet money from sponsers who were willing to cash up because of the spot, just to stay afloat
For the good of the game? Pffft.
instead of all this whining, why doesnt australia prove they deserve the full spot.. I mean.. all aussies bragged about beating england in the uk in a friendly... but you complain because they make you play 2 real matches to get into the world cup?...
whats so fair about a team that wins 20-0, 34-0 every qualification match... now, if they made australia play the asian qualification, or play against the 5th asian or 4th asian team instead of the 5th south american... but c'mon...
whats so fair about a team that wins 20-0, 34-0 every qualification match... now, if they made australia play the asian qualification, or play against the 5th asian or 4th asian team instead of the 5th south american... but c'mon...
juventusita
Senior Squad
In a nutshell, Australia, I mean Oceania, does not deserve a direct place. Asia doesn't deserve more than 3 (maybe 3.5 to play Oceania's 0.5). Anyone that thinks otherwise clearly is from Oceania or Asia (or has no idea what they are talking about). It's good that Australians care so much about a direct spot, because if they didn't then that would be sad, but obviously if you can't beat the fifth place team from South America then do you really deserve to be there? There's always complaining about not having quality opposition before playing the playoff... well, blame SA for not scheduling any, not FIFA. They are doing the right thing here, they are overturning the politics that got Oceania a place to begin with. Contrary to what you might think, every nation that gets in the World Cup had a difficult time getting there. However, a direct spot for Oceania would allow Australia to get there relatively easy. For example, in CONCACAF no team has it easy. Playing away in Mexico, Honduras, Costa Rica, or any of the smaller Central American countries is quite a task. The quality of football is also better than you think because football has been popular there for a long time. In Oceania, where football has not been popular at all really, you've got 2 nations that are worth mentioning, while every other one is just a joke.
How come all the "complainers
" cannot understand Oceania is a pissweak confederation. For us to earn it, we must beat quality teams. It is farcical we have to go to South America and play tough competition we never experience. This is why Oceanic qualifying should be early. The top 2 teams go into Asia. IT IS SIMPLE!
" cannot understand Oceania is a pissweak confederation. For us to earn it, we must beat quality teams. It is farcical we have to go to South America and play tough competition we never experience. This is why Oceanic qualifying should be early. The top 2 teams go into Asia. IT IS SIMPLE!
The 4 best countries SHOULD 100% of the time qualify for the world cup. The 5th deserves a playoff. This is not only because they rank among the world's elite, but because of their history in the game and there accomplishments. Remember 9 World cups have been won by SA, no oceania country has proved that they deserve to be given preference over a SA country.
South America is getting what it deserves, on the other hand, Asia isn't. Your argument isn't with CONMEBOL, but with the AFC who are getting far too many places than they deserve.
Originally posted by JTNY
How come all the "complainers
Your the only Aussie making sense. I appreciate the unbiased view and all of your points are agreed by the majority of people living outside of the confederation.
I think I know exactly what it takes to make it to the world cup. Busting your ass off for 18 games in the harshest conditions, suffering from EVERY factor the Australian team faces(travel, altitude, club/country battle, no gel time). It's so obvious a south american nation should be given preference to any oceania team. If your going to argue atleast come up with something good.
However, I see the argument for taking away a spot for Asia, there recent performances(Saudi Arabia, China) don't merit such a high number of places. That's where YOUR argument should be focused
