Punk music

[Elder]

Originally posted by ShiftyPowers
I'm more of the "I'll go toe to toe with you on the music, but I just can't live the lifestyle"

The Ramones are the reason why those bands existed.

I agree with you, but it still doesn't make them good. I think we are allowed to disagree.

 

[Lennon]

Rancid's latest album Indestructible was not Epitaph, the label was Bobcat or something like that which is a subsidiary of Warner. The limited Indestructible album had the Warner label, and as far as I'm concerned Warner is one of the 'big boys' of the music industry.
And then we have Bad Religion, who in the 90s went to Atlantic and then even Sony. But I don't really care about this stuff

Originally posted by Joe
You know what? Who gives a f-ck if the band is in it for the money. If it f-cking sounds good, who cares? Good for them. Capitalism at its finest. Entrepeneurs if you will--making a business out of their skill.

Exactly. Who gives a f**k if this band has a major label deal and this doesn't?? It's all about the music!! I really can't understand the people who turned down some bands just because they signed with a major label, that is just plain dumb

 

[Shindig]

Originally posted by Elder
Rancid is Ska?

Yes, to me they are a retarded version of Madness. Musicly, I mean.

Punk's too generic nowadays, anyhow. Too much of a commercial goldmine. I'll have a look at Crass.

 

[Elder]

Originally posted by Lennon




Exactly. Who gives a f**k if this band has a major label deal and this doesn't?? It's all about the music!! I really can't understand the people who turned down some bands just because they signed with a major label, that is just plain dumb

People care because of how some bands present themselves as "anti establishment" and things of this nature. Only to gather a strong fan base, sign to a major label and go against everything they have been preaching the whole time.

And it's usually a fact that once a band signs to a major label, they lose some of that independent attitude and it ends up showing in their music. Green Day, Offspring, Rancid, Bad Religion all come to mind. They are all terrible now. It's just how the business works, your music changes.

 

[Solo Inter]

Its all how you look at it....and every band has a different story.

Fact is..if you want to talk about selling out (its a stupid term)..well for me...soon as you sell your record..you selling out.

See-Tool Hooker with a Penis

I met a boy wearing Vans, 501s, and a
Dope Beastie t, nipple rings, and
New tattoos that claimed that he
Was OGT,
From '92,
The first EP.

And in between
Sips of Coke
He told me that
He thought
We were sellin' out,
Layin' down,
Suckin' up
To the man.

Well now I've got some
A-dvice for you, little buddy.
Before you point the finger
You should know that
I'm the man,

And if I'm the man,

Then you're the man, and
He's the man as well so you can
Point that ****in' finger up your ass.

All you know about me is what I've sold you,
Dumb ****.
I sold out long before you ever heard my name.

I sold my soul to make a record,
Dip ****,
And you bought one.

So I've got some
Advice for you, little buddy.
Before you point your finger
You should know that
I'm the man,

If I'm the ****in' man
Then you're the ****in' man as well
So you can
Point that ****in' finger up your ass.

All you know about me is what I've sold you,
Dumb ****.
I sold out long before you ever heard my name.

I sold my soul to make a record,
Dip ****,
And you bought one.

All you read and
Wear or see and
Hear on TV
Is a product
Begging for your
Fatass dirty
Dollar

So...Shut up and

Buy my new record
Send more money
**** you, buddy.




This line sums it up "I sold my soul to make a record,
Dip ****,
And you bought one."

So I agree with Maynard and the Pharcyde-"Cause Everytime I step to the microphone I put my soul on 2" reels That I don't even own....."

As for Bad Religion...like I said..every band is different. Yes they're weaker now..but some of their best stuff after they left Epitaph...I don't know If I agree that they should have left though. Gregg Graffin does adress this on the BR website. He knows how many poeple talked about them selling out. His defence is that if he could sign with Atlantic and get his albums sold in Brazil or Japan or wherever...then he wanted to do it. To spread the message of Bad Religion...you can take it how you want.

Anyway...BR has now gone back to Epitaph ann made an album with Brett again...and it is a badass album...far better then their two previous attempts.

 

[Solo Inter]

Originally posted by Shindig
Yes, to me they are a retarded version of Madness. Musicly, I mean.

Punk's too generic nowadays, anyhow. Too much of a commercial goldmine. I'll have a look at Crass.

Right on Mate!!!!!!

I'll stick w/ my Subhumans, Conflict, and Crass albums....real punk rock there...oh yeah Subhumans playing in Dallas next week...can hardly wait.

One band who is modern and haven't sold out in any way that I know of is Propaghandi...totally political, vegetarians, and cery serious.

 

[Solo Inter]

So Elder...I get what you're saying about the guy in the garage thing.

But where do you draw the line? Epitaph is big now but it took a LONG time.

Its a quandry...were they suppose to stop after they got so big and say "well were not going to promote or sign any new band cause we will be selling out"?

Though for once I actually see what your saying.

 

[Elder]

Originally posted by Solo Inter
So Elder...I get what you're saying about the guy in the garage thing.

But where do you draw the line? Epitaph is big now but it took a LONG time.

Its a quandry...were they suppose to stop after they got so big and say "well were not going to promote or sign any new band cause we will be selling out"?

Though for once I actually see what your saying.

Well I think it's hard to draw the line. But with Epitaph I see them now as a major label, more than an independent record label. I think it's great that they were able to work hard and make their label what it is today.. Actually, I think they got lucky with Rancid and Offspring, but that's not the point. Some of the bands they have signed now are bands I once knew, or saw in someones living room... But it all comes down to how they market their product now as to how they marketed their product before they got big. Are they still really "independent" or are they just using that as their marketing strategy?

But your choice of bands in the previous post is pretty good. Conflict is good and Propaghandi was/is one of the best punk bands around. There are some other punk bands out there that are good as well. Cripple Bastards, Capitalist Casualties etc.

It's a tough genre to pin down, and usually ends up being debated forever as to what "True" punk really is.

 

[Tom Green]

Originally posted by Solo Inter
Right on Mate!!!!!!

I'll stick w/ my Subhumans, Conflict, and Crass albums....real punk rock there...oh yeah Subhumans playing in Dallas next week...can hardly wait.

One band who is modern and haven't sold out in any way that I know of is Propaghandi...totally political, vegetarians, and cery serious.

Holy sh1t, you're actually going to see Subhumans? They are one of my favorite bands ever, in fact, I'm wearing a Subhumans shirt right now, and I have a Subhumans patch on my Carlos*et, really f_cking awesome band.

 

[ShiftyPowers]

Originally posted by Elder
Rancid is Ska?

Rancid is ska in the same way that Operation Ivy was ska, which makes sence because Rancid has two member of Op Ivy. They are influenced more in my opinion by Two Tone bands like The Specials and then of course The Clash who expanded on the Two Tone genre. They're not trying to be hardcore punk, but they're doing their own thing, which I like. That being said, their two best albums are "And out come the wolves" and "Let's Go" which came out ages ago.

Saw them at the warped tour this summer (went just to see them for the most part) and they were pretty kick ass. They know what their best stuff is, and almost everything they played was off those two albums. Tim has become somewhat like a God, Matt Freeman might be the best bassist I've ever seen, and I shook hands with Lars Fredrickson (who's still trying to keep in touch with his roots with his side project Lars Fredrickson and the Bastards).

And can someone tell me the difference between Hellcat Records and Epitaph?

 

[Tom Green]

Rancid aren't ska, I got every one of their cds, and they're 99% punk rock, with a few ska songs here and there, Operation Ivy on the other hand, was pure ska-punk.

 

[Shindig]

Finally listened to some Crass.

They ain't my cup of tea....

 

[Elder]

Originally posted by Shindig
Finally listened to some Crass.

They ain't my cup of tea....

But at least you heard a taste of true British punk! But then you will get the debate over what is relaly British punk. Ah, it's all too confusing!

Check out Conflict or Subhumans. How about some bass driven punk? Man is the Bastard... good stuff!

 

[LuckyStrike]

I won't consider a band to be sellouts unless they go back on what they have previously stated/belived. Take H20 for example. When they first came out, Toby would rail against the MTV influence and demand that we keep the scene strong. One album later H20 is shooting a video for MTV in the bowery and they have a new, bigger label.

I know that playing the garage won't pay the bills and that doing what you love and getting paid for it is the best thing in the world. But if you trample your own ideals in the process you are nothing but a sellout.

 

[Lennon]

Selling out is when you do something against your will or something that you don't like for money.
In other words, selling out will be Green Day or Bad religion turning into a pop boy band like N sync, that's what I think.

I just don't get it when people say (for eg) Offspring are sellouts. They left Epitaph because they got a much better contract with a major label, Columbia, and they did a pretty good album, Ixnay on the Hombre (my fav album of theirs) which is very similar to Smash. They maintained their style, they kept doing what they like and they got payed better for that. Sounds like a good deal to me

 

[Elder]

Originally posted by LuckyStrike
I won't consider a band to be sellouts unless they go back on what they have previously stated/belived. Take H20 for example. When they first came out, Toby would rail against the MTV influence and demand that we keep the scene strong. One album later H20 is shooting a video for MTV in the bowery and they have a new, bigger label.

I know that playing the garage won't pay the bills and that doing what you love and getting paid for it is the best thing in the world. But if you trample your own ideals in the process you are nothing but a sellout.

haha, H2O. Man, they were always terrible from the start. And you would be surprised how much playing small shows makes you.

A ton of bands from back in the day were making loads of cash from Guaranteed contracts.. Earth Crisis, Snapcase, Stife, Sick of it All, bands like that. Many people considered them sellouts just because they wanted guaranteed contracts for shows.

It's a very difficult situation to be in.. "selling out" is about what you described.. and most bands who sign to a major label are sellouts. Their music does change. I remember when New Found Glory started.. my friend actually started the band but was kicked out once things got serious... His quote to me for starting the band "we want to get girls." But now they confiscate videos that kids are shooting on their concerts.. it's pretty sad.

 

[Joe]

Originally posted by Elder
I remember when New Found Glory started.. my friend actually started the band but was kicked out once things got serious... His quote to me for starting the band "we want to get girls."

Prove it.

 

[Elder]

Originally posted by Joe
Prove it.

His name is Peter, his lives in South Florida and his father started the "Miami Subs" fast food chain. He also played in a band called Bird of Ill Omen. Little Chad of NFG used to sing a band called Shai Halud and I met him when he was 16 while previewing a test press record for a band called Morning Again.

I used to spend a lot of time in Florida. Actually, I spent time in Coral Springs, where NFG is from. Mutual friends, blah blah blah. Big shows were done at Club Q in Miami. The scene down there was all fairly close together as far as the bands went and everyone knew each other. I guess it was mainly a straight edge scene, as I was also at the time. Let's see.. some bands from down there.. at the time, and present. Poison the Well, Culture, Shai Halud, Morning Again, NFG, When Fear and Weapons Meet, Bird of Ill Omen, Glasseater, and so on.

What else do you want to know?

 

[Elder]

Originally posted by Joe
Prove it.

By the way, in case you didn't know, NFG's first demo is titled.. "It's all about the girls."

 

[LuckyStrike]

Shai Halud

badass